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Amazon Music | Apple Podcasts | Google Play | iHeart Radio | Pandora | Radio Public | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn | YouTube CONNECT WITH THE TURN ON Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | Goodreads | Patreon SHOW NOTES In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya are reading "Looking" by Katrina Jackson and talking about evolving relationships, expanding dating horizons and beardfishing. RESOURCES
ADVERTISEMENT Buzzsprout The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information. TRANSCRIPT Kenrya: Come here. Get off. [theme music] Erica: So... Hey, y'all. Welcome to this week's episode of The Turn On. This is your host, Erica. Your hoe host... Kenrya: Kenrya. Hey y'all. Erica: Killa. And today we are reading... Okay, so today we're reading this book. It's called “Looking” and it is by Katrina Jackson, who is just... Just when I finished this book, I was like, "This is a Katrina Jackson stan account." So, she slid in our DMs one day, because we did her book Look... Not, shit, “Looking.” We did her book “Welcome to Seaport”- Kenrya: Yes, and that was awesome. Erica: ... a while back. Which was awesome and filthy. And she was like, “I would love to hear Kenrya read…” And we was like, "Say less fam." Kenrya: Literally. Erica: And I'm glad we did, because we are about to get into an amazing book. So sit back, relax, get your wine, your weed, and whatever you need. And enjoy. Kenrya: “Looking” by Katrina Jackson. The hero of the film betrays someone or something. I don't know. Everyone looks the same and I don't really hear what's happening. I'm just about to tell them that when Darren lifts the armrest between us and leans into my side. He doesn't need to say anything. I know what his soft breath on my jaw means. His hand nudging my outer thigh, his smile against my earlobe. I scoot closer, turning toward Jordan. The screen casts her profile in shadow, and maybe it's my growing infatuation with her or the fact that we're here at her request or because my pussy is already clenching knowing what's coming, but I think her beauty is unmatched in that moment. Kenrya: Darren drapes his body casually around my back. He sometimes holds me like this in bed. Falling asleep like this is a top tier perk of spending more than a decade with someone who loves all kinds of physical intimacy, but I'm anything but tired. The frustrated desire this movie had almost killed stretches its limbs. Kenrya: It might be my imagination because this movie is loud as fuck, but I swear I can hear Darren's belt buckle and zipper come undone. The back of his hand brushing against my ass as he fishes his dick from his boxers isn't imaginary. I pull my dress up in the back, ready for him. So fucking ready for him. I lift my left leg and whimper when the spongy head of his dick brushes my pussy from the back. He slides between my thighs, grunts into my ear because I'm wet. Bad movie and all, I'm still wet. Darren rubs the length of his shaft between my lips, lubricating himself and bumping up against my clit until I'm wetter than before and we're both breathing heavily. Something explodes on screen just as he pushes inside of me and I cry out gratefully. Kenrya: I open my eyes quickly and look down at the theater, trying to see if anyone heard me or turned our way, but so far as I can tell, we're still in the clear. But then I look at Jordan and see her watching us. She's holding her bag of popcorn in her lap and pops a few kernels into her mouth and chews, the curve of a smile on her face. Darren starts to move inside of me. I love this angle on the best of days, but this experience makes an old favorite feel brand new. It's the sound of the movie, knowing that we can't get too wild or loud or else we'll draw someone's unwanted attention, or that we're one trip to the bathroom or turned head away from being discovered. All of it drives me to a shuddering orgasm with only a few deep strokes. Kenrya: I reach back to cup Darren's head and he stills inside of me while I pulse around him with my eyes shut. "Okay?" he whispers. "I just need a second," I breathe. We both feel Jordan move. When I open my eye, she's lifted the armrest between us and she's scooting closer. I hold my breath, but Darren is panting against my ear. He leans toward me and presses a gentle kiss against my lip. It's lovely and full of emotion, at least on my end. Thank God her mouth is there to muffle my scream when I feel her fingers against my clit and all hell breaks mildly loose. Kenrya: We're just careful enough after that not to draw attention, but to be honest I don't think any of us gives a shit about getting caught since we don't stop fucking and touching and kissing and licking one another. Darren's fucking me faster, harder. Jordan's fingers are slippery from my first release. Sometimes she replaces her fingers on my lips with the heel of her palm on my clit. When she does that, Darren lets out a wheezy grunt as her fingers brush the base of his shaft. Kenrya: I feel Darren's free hand snake around my body. I don't know what he's up to until Jordan laughs against my lips and breaks our kiss. He replaces her mouth with her bare breast that Darren has pulled free. There's no careful preparation, no time to consider what I think about this first time I felt another woman's nipple against my lips as an adult. There's no time for me to overthink this moment. There's only time to explore the rich contours of her nipple with my tongue, to feel her areola against my lip, and to experience the way she shudders when I suck the hard nub into my mouth for definitely not the last time. Jordan sighs and then Darren grunts. I can hear them kissing, but can't quite find the right angle in the dark theater to see it. Kenrya: If I have any complaints, that's the only one. I want to see and feel and hear everything but I can't. "Next time," I promise myself. And then I clench around Darren's shaft, coming again, using Jordan's breasts to muffle the sound of my scream. Darren groans against her lips and I feel her wet hand grip the base of his shaft as he releases deep inside me. When he's finished, Jordan's hand smooths over my pussy. I jump and tighten around Darren as she grazes my clit. He groans tiredly, a little louder than necessary. We all turn toward the theater to check that we haven't been spotted. When I look back at Jordan, she's slipping her wet fingers into her mouth. "God," I groan. "Told you," Darren whispers, easing his dick out of me. We get ourselves together, kind of. I wish I brought a pair of underwear for the aftermath. Kenrya: It's a very strange feeling to worry if my husband's cum will seep out of me and run down my leg as soon as I stand up. "Well, that was fun," Jordan says. "This movie is bad, so I'm going to dip. I'll call you two tomorrow?" I nod slowly. "Text us when you get home," Darren says. Thank the Lord for his ability to be ever responsible. Jordan leans over and kisses him briefly on the lips. Of course. And then she kisses me. "Was it good?" I laugh. "Amazing." And she kisses me again. And then she's bouncing up from her seat. The bag of popcorn, a drink I'd honestly forgotten she had in one hand and her purse and the other, throwing it over her shoulder. We watch her with heaving chests. "She stole your Red Vines," Darren says when she's gone. "She earned them," I say. We both laugh. "Shh," someone calls across the theater. We laugh harder. Erica: Okay y'all, we're back. So, this book was... I read it... Oh, let's get... I'm about to jump in. Okay, let's give the synopsis. Kenrya: Oh, right. Erica: So there's this couple, Darren and Nadia. They are just the cutest fucking couple. They were married. One of their good married friends hit them with the, "Hey, y'all, we divorcing." And it caused them to reexamine their marriage and they decided, "Look, we're good, but we should go to therapy." They go to therapy and in therapy they realize, "We're bored. Let's spice things up a bit. Let's get a girlfriend." So this story is about them- Kenrya: Looking. Erica: ... and their process of finding. What'd you say? Kenrya: Looking for a girlfriend. Erica: Yeah, looking for a girlfriend. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Bitch. Kenrya: It's so good. Erica: It was well written. So it took Kenrya, what? Two days to read this book? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). I don't even think it was a full two days. I started before bed and finished the next afternoon or something stupid. Erica: It took me a little longer primarily because I was the master debater of this book. Kenrya: Yeah, if I'd had energy. Erica: It was every fucking scene. I was like, "Well, about to go blind again." Kenrya: Time to go. Yep. Erica: Palm's about to get hairy. Because it was... I was rubbing one out every fucking scene. Katrina, you are- Kenrya: A fucking master. Erica: Fucking disgusting and delightful. Kenrya: Sometimes- Erica: All in the same one. Kenrya: Yo, sometimes we have books and it's hard to find a good scene. The book is great, right, but there's not a ton of sex in it. But with this one it was like, "Which one do we choose? There are so many." Erica: Girl. And she writes... She not only writes the sex well, but she writes the anticipation and the hormones coursing through your body and just... Woo, girl. Even she wrote a fucking hand job great. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: I was just- Kenrya: I don't even like those. Erica: I don't either, but I was like, "Goddamn, this bitch is just... This bitch." Oh, okay. So a little bit more about the story. So Katrina has a Patreon, so right now this book is only available to her Patreon subscribers. We'll make sure we include that in there. At some point she will be releasing this to the general public, but y'all... Kenrya: Support a Black writer. Erica: Support a Black writer, and support your regions. Because I tell you... Goddamn, goddamn, goddamn. Kenrya: Your nethers. Erica: I can't get past how fucking good the scenes were. And also, she did a great... So this is one of those books where it's written from everybody's perspective. She did a really good job of getting in everyone's head without making it seem like this, "Oh, crazy, fraught" kind of thing. But just... Kenrya: Erica's mind is like the mind blown emoji. Erica: That final scene. Kenrya: Oh, yeah. Erica: Oh my gosh. It was just... Kenrya: And I was like, "I wasn't expecting that." I was like, "Oh, we get another." Erica: Yeah, it was great. It was delightful. So yeah, it was... Kenrya: Great. Erica: Okay, so like we said, this was a couple. They had been together since they were in college. And one of the things I think that we forget is that you grow. You're never going to be the same person- Kenrya: Hopefully. Erica: ... in a relationship. And it is important for you to remember that, "Yo, we're changing and we need to learn how to love and operate and have a life and parent and all this with this changed person." So I think it was really dope that they were like, "Oh, shit. We need therapy to just make sure we're still on the same page." And they went to therapy while they were healthy. Kenrya: I would say it was a very healthy decision that they made, right? And they didn't wait until shit had devolved like I think a lot of times- Erica: Most people do. Kenrya: Yeah. Things have gotten to the point where it feels like that is the only effort, only thing that you have, the only option that you have. And they were like, "We should do this preemptively." Erica: And I thought that was so great. And there was a lot of thought in the book from primarily Nadia, but I think Darren did it a little bit too, about, "I'm not the same person I was when I was younger, and I am dealing with that part of me." Dealing with the grown and changed person. And also recognizing that what's good at some point in your relationship, ain't always going to be good. Them finding a girlfriend, ain't always going to be good, but... I mean, wouldn't have always been a good place- Kenrya: For them. Erica: ... a good thing for their relationship. But it was a step that was natural at that point. Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Which really goes to that point that your relationship is what you make it, right? Erica: Yes, this book- Kenrya: You got to build the thing that works for you. Erica: This book was a love letter to that idea, that it's what you make it. I'm going to jump ahead just a little bit, but I thought that it was very... They were committed to having a girlfriend. "We going to have a girlfriend, we going to incorporate her in our life. Our lives" Lives... Kenrya: Lives is... Yes. Erica: Lives. Erica: "We're going to incorporate her in our lives." And I just thought, "Wow, y'all are really adults." Because I will say it takes a certain someone to be like... A certain fortitude to be like, "No, this is what the fuck works for me and my family, so we going to make it work." Because even as they were dating, they started having dreams of like, "Oh, all three of us. And us and the boys," and all of that. And I was like, "Whoa, this is like..." Kenrya: Right. So one thing we haven't mentioned is that they had two children. Erica: Yes. Kenrya: And yeah, there was a lot of... I like that that was a part of the consideration was like, "We have kids and how do we introduce this change in our lives to our children?" And I don't want to give too much away, but that was a part of the story. But yeah, they were very committed and they went through a process together. I think the book opens with them swiping, looking for somebody. Erica: Even just that fucking scene just drew me in. We going to have Katrina on this show and I'm going to... She's lucky we not in person, because I'm going to smack her. I would've smacked her and been like, "Bitch, why are you writing like this?" Kenrya: Yeah, it's fucking dope. Erica: And I think she'd appreciate it. So... Oh, were you going to say- Kenrya: I was just going to say that Nadia was really, to me, the driving force of making this actually happen. Because Darren kept having these guilty moments. "I feel I'm cheating on my wife," and she was like, "Nigga, I'm on the phone." Erica: Well, and the thing is also, I think Darren... If they didn't take this step, Darren would've been a nigga unhappy, not- Kenrya: You think so? Erica: Not unhappy, but he would have locked himself in. "This is what our relationship is. I love my wife. I'm not going to..." He would've been in happiness level 1B, where now he at happiness level 1A because he actually followed his wife's ideas. So, you get what I'm saying? Kenrya: Yeah, yeah. She unlocked what they needed and he would've never brought it up because that's a lot. Erica: That's his wife and his family and respect and da da da da. Kenrya: Exactly. And he was really stuck in that. Erica: Okay, so first, I apologize. I'm letting my hair grow out, and so I definitely feel like Moesha's daddy. Kenrya: Frank! Erica: Yeah, I feel like Frank Mitchell. Kenrya: You do not look like Frank. Erica: Because I got the Black man box. Kenrya: No you don't. Erica: This isn't.. This is a- Kenrya: It's actually cute. Erica: This is the "I'm old and I still have my hairline box" that old Black man do when they got their hairline. And like, "I'm going to stunt on these niggas." They do this. Kenrya: What's the plan? You growing it out or what? Erica: So, I don't know. I definitely want this grown out. This is going to come down. And I want the... Kenrya: Oh, okay. Erica: And I think I want a color, but I'm not sure because... Kenrya: Your hair hadn't been holding color for a while, right? Erica: It hadn't been holding color, but I don't think I was... I wasn't using... I was just washing my hair with Suave. Kenrya: So you need to be taking better care of your hair. Just saying. Okay. Erica: Okay, so them and the whole "fuck what y'all think, I'm going to do what I want" thing. It brought up something that I'm dealing with right now. Kenrya: Oh, what? Erica: So, I'm on the apps. I'm trying to date. So I changed my profile. First it was like, "Accepting men only." Right? So now I opened it up to nonbinary folk, right? I don't think I could be with a female presenting person, a feminine presenting person. Female presenting, feminine presenting. You get what I'm saying, right? Erica: And I'm trying not to be... Not outrageous. Not trying to be offensive. Other O word. Not trying to be offensive, as I describe it. Yeah, I don't... I just... And the fact that I'm dealing with this has me wondering, "Am I dealing with this because I care about folks? I care about being with a male presenting person, or is it just that I just don't get my rocks from a female presenting person?" Kenrya: Boo. Erica: When I do kind of, because I have sex with them. Kenrya: I'm about to say you eat pussy, so... Erica: I mean, you ain't have to put it like that. Kenrya: Sorry. Erica: But I do. No, I'm fucking with you. But I don't know if I- Kenrya: No, I'm just trying to... Yeah, talk to me about it. Erica: I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. And the fact that I was hesitant, makes me... Bothers me. So I don't know. Also, this person wasn't the hottest, so maybe if they were hotter, I'd be... But just the fact that I was just like, "Hmm, didn't think about this. I don't know if I can do this," has me wondering, "What the fuck is going on with me? What am I doing?" Kenrya: Well, I mean, I don't know. We want to be with the people who we're attracted to, right? Maybe this is a therapy conversation to get at if it's... Is it just that person you're not attracted to? Is it female presenting folks who you're not attracted to? Erica: That's what I'm... Kenrya: Or is it... I don't know. I mean, we've talked before about your- Erica: And they had long hair. Kenrya: What is... So you just don't like people with long hair? No niggas with cornrows? No? No? Erica: I swiped on a nigga with locs and it was like, "Okay, Erica." Kenrya: Yeah, locs be upgrading niggas though. Because sometimes you'll see somebody without their locs and be like, "Holy [crosstalk 00:21:57]." Yeah, it's like a beard. Erica: A fucking beard. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Beards. If I see a guy and he has one picture with no beard or short beard, I'm like, "Nope, because there's a possibility that you may go back there." Kenrya: That you going to take that shit off. Erica: And I'm going to be up-fucking-set. I'm going to be like, "Bruh." Kenrya: I remember way back, it was some dude who I- Erica: I'll be like, "Put this on your face so we can have sex." Kenrya: I think- Erica: Just keep little... Keep little merkins. Kenrya: I think we talked about this, because it was also on “Schitt's Creek” where this chick was dating a dude and he had a beard and then he cut it off and she was like, "What the fuck? Who are you?" Erica: Yeah, you told me. Yeah, give them a little merkins. Are merkins just for pussies and stuff? Kenrya: I mean, yeah. Usually it's- Erica: I mean for- Kenrya: Yeah, to cover your vulva. It's a little vulva wig. But you know what, my partner did tell me that they have fake beards. Erica: Fuck yeah, they're like lace fronts. Kenrya: Oh my God. I don't understand. See? And this is... Okay, so you fucking with a dude who got a weak ass chin or a person with a weak chin who has a beard. And then when you have a baby with them, and then your baby don't have no chin. Erica: Then you got a little weak chin baby. Kenrya: It's like fucking with a Kardashian. Erica: Or- Kenrya: What is your kid going to look like? Erica: Or they don't have no lips, and then you can't tell because they have on a beard. Because they wearing a beard. Kenrya: No. I mean, you would feel that when you kiss them, but ugh. Erica: It's just like a little slit [inaudible 00:23:34]. Kenrya: Ugh. Erica: So you know what? So my therapist, our new therapist. Kenrya: Our new therapist, yes. Erica: Our new therapist. One, she's making me come weekly. Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Me too. Erica: So we can get to know each other. I'm like, "Girl, every week?" But it's been good. It's been fine, because... You guys missed it. Poops passed away. Kenrya: Oh, yeah. Erica: Our studio dog. He passed away over the holiday right before Christmas. Kenrya: He did. Erica: Had to put him down. It was a very sad situation. But a bitch is strong. And Brother's thinking about getting a dog, a little tiny dog. Yeah, so there'll be a little... And it's going to be his dog, but I've definitely been like, "Look at this. Don't you want to go see this one today? What about this?" Kenrya: You know my child is going to be trying to commandeer a little dog. Lord. Erica: And that is fine. That is fine. Oh, so seeing the new therapist and one of the things she told me to do, because I'm dealing with my raisin titty. And so she's like, "Find a body part that you love and stare at it in the mirror." And so it's been my lips because not everyone is blessed to have them. Kenrya: It's true, it's true. Shit, I grew up my whole life being envious. So there's a... I call them the Rankin Lips. It's a very specific lip that my whole family has and I don't have them. And I like my lips, they're fine. But them Rankin Lips, they just... They're beautiful. They're just big and juicy and I don't have them. I covet. Erica: So we have the Easter Eyebrows. Everybody got the thick ass- Kenrya: Y'all sure do. Erica: Everybody got thick ass eyebrows. We had a family... I guess a Zoom, but it's on Facebook or some shit. We did a family group chat Christmas Eve, and it was just like... In every fucking frame. And for the women it was just really defined. Kenrya: Right. Erica: And thick. In the nineties, my was shit was so not in fashion, but now a bitch is doing it right. Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). That's what everybody be trying to get to. Erica: Bitch is doing right. Erica: Okay, so went to therapy when they're healthy, recognized that they have grown and wanted to try something new. They were such a cute couple. And not in an annoying, cheesy way. But just in a, "We love and support..." We need more books like that, like this. Kenrya: With what? Very loving married couples? Erica: More characters like this. Loving, married couples that aren't huge sweeping declarations. You could just tell that they loved each other in the simplicity and the thoughtfulness. Even the scene where he called her, he told her.... He told... Darren told Nadia. Erica: Sorry, I keep forgetting the names, so I'm looking at... Darren told Nadia, "Stay home from work today." And then he ordered her favorite breakfast. So simple, but such a loving act. It's just... Ugh. They were so disgustingly cute in the most healthy, "Ooh, I want some of that," kind of way. Kenrya: Hmm, yeah. Erica: Hashtag couple goals. Except we don't like saying... Kenrya: I'm about to say, I don't like that. But of course I'm sitting over here reminiscing about nice things. Erica: Aww. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: That's so sweet. Kenrya: My partner has been trying to buy his leased car for weeks, and they've been giving him the runaround. It's like he trying to give them money and they just making things difficult. And one day he went to two dealerships and the bank, literally hours spent doing this, didn't get to eat. Erica: Oh, no. Kenrya: First he had to go see a client who was 45 minutes late. Then he had to go do all of that, and he hadn't eaten after he finished all of that. So by the time he got home, I had ordered him lunch so that when he got home, he would actually have something to eat as soon as he got there. His favorite meal to his door, because these are the things we do when we care about. Erica: That's so sweet. Well, I'm looking. Please, Lord. I've seen what you've done for others. Please do that for me. Amen. Kenrya: Amen. Erica: Ashe. Abadullah. Kenrya: Okay. Erica: Oblongata. Kenrya: I hate you. Erica: Okay. So at one point in the story... Okay, I'm jumping ahead. Okay, so at one point in the story, Jordan lashes out at Darren. Won't give too many details, but she lashes out at Darren, and there were so many layers to it. But so many... When she later explained, he was like, "Oh, yeah, that makes sense." Kenrya: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Erica: I've seen it, I've done it. It made so much sense. And it was pretty much coming from a place of he was genuinely trying to be helpful, but it was her feelings of inadequacy and embarrassment that caused her to lash out at him. And it just made me think like, "Oof, I've totally been in that situation." Erica: I remember I was dating this guy, and this was... I think this was when I was making $2,700 a month. I mean, $27,000. Put another zero over that, Erica. Kenrya: A year. Erica: $27,000 a year, getting paid once a month. That's what it was. Kenrya: Oh, I know where you were working Erica: Child. I was struggling and surviving. Jesus on a good line. Good times. Kenrya: Yep. Erica: So that was where I was. And I remember I was dating this guy, and he would always come pick me up. And this particular day he was like, "I'm super busy, can't pick you up. Just come to my house and I'll reimburse you for the cab." Because he lived in one that was high rises. So it wasn't like... And this was... Kenrya: Before Uber. Erica: I wasn't in the covered wagon, but it was definitely before Uber. So I needed to pay this motherfucker when I got in. So I felt so inadequate, because I was like, "You don't even recognize that I ain't even got it to get to your place, to pay this man to get the money back from you when I get upstairs." So yeah. So, he was like, "Just come over. I'll pay back, da da da." And I lashed out, picked a fight, da da da. Erica: So then he does this thing. He comes to pick me up. No, he was like, "I'm coming over there, because I don't know what the... This shit came out of nowhere. I'm coming there. What the fuck happened?" So he comes over. I'm still like, "I'm a bitch, you're an asshole." And so we get to the bottom of it, and he was like, "What?" And he writes me a $500 check on the spot, because he's just like, "Bitch, how about you not..." Kenrya: You need to have some money in your pocket. Yeah. Erica: Yeah, exactly. And I was just like, "Thanks." Kenrya: Choked your damn self. Erica: But it definitely reminded me of that situation. And it's tough, especially when you're used to handling it and... Kenrya: Yeah, projecting is a thing that we sometimes do when we don't mean to. Even with small stuff. I'm struggling to think of a time I've done that in a romantic relationship, although I'm certain that I have. But I did it a couple of days ago with a friend. She's going through some stuff and I reached out and was like, "What can I do for you today?" And she didn't answer. And then when I texted her, we were texting later, and I asked again and she didn't answer. I texted her back and I said, "Yo." Erica: “Look, bitch.” Kenrya: Right. I was like, "Listen, I noticed that you ignored me both times when I asked how I could help. But I'm really serious about helping. What can I do?" And she was like, "I'm sorry. The first time I didn't see it. The second time I was trying to hurry up and finish washing dishes. I wasn't ignoring it." And I was like, "I'm sorry." And she's like, "Why?" I was like, "Because I'm projecting." I was like, "I have some friends who I have been trying to help, and they basically keep being like, 'You got enough of your own shit going on. You can't help me.'" And I was like, "And that actually really bothers me." I was like, "So I was projecting on you that you were doing the same thing that has been going on. And it's obviously bothering me, and I'm really sorry." And then I gave her some concrete suggestions on things I could do to help rather than expecting her to tell me what she could do. Which is also a thing that bothers me. Erica: You are just such a fucking adult. I don't know how I ended up with you as a fucking best friend, because I just flop out and... Kenrya: I'm just trying to be good to people. And, yeah. Also I get a lot of joy from helping the people who I care about. A lot. I'm realizing as I really pare down what I do in a day. So it means a lot to me when some of that thing that I do can be for somebody else. And so when folks are like, "Nah, you got too much." I'm like, "I wouldn't offer if I didn't mean it." Erica: Give me something to do to keep my mind off of all of the much that I have to do. Kenrya: Yeah, it just brings me a lot of joy. But anyway, all that to say I projected and came in hot when I did not need to. Erica: Ooh, child. Kenrya: I'm like, "You was ignoring me." Erica: Yeah, I come in hot. I definitely come in hot. Shit, my ex-husband could probably give you a million motherfucking situations where I came. I recognized that I was not always... Shit, I recognize that I'm still not always... But yeah, I definitely have come in hot, per se, on some shit knowing good and well, as my granny would say, loud and wrong. Loud and wrong. Kenrya: It's a thing that we all are sometimes. One thing that was interesting to me, now that you bring up the conflict though, is that in a lot of romances the conflict feels a bit... Not manufactured, but... Erica: If y'all had a cell phone, this shit would be over in three seconds. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Or... Yeah. Mm-hmm (affirmative). Kenrya: But this felt like a genuine, deeply felt thing that she was dealing with. It felt earned, and it felt true to her character. Erica: But also, because Katrina's such a good writer, she set us up for it. Not even realizing that we were... She set us up for it not even thinking that we were being set up. But then when you're like, "Oh, okay." Kenrya: Oh, yeah. Erica: So yeah, it was... Bitch is good. Kenrya: Yeah. And then they resolved it like adults. Erica: They resolve it like adults. And how do they resolve it? They run into each other. So- Kenrya: Yeah, randomly. Erica: What happened? So they lose touch and then they randomly run into to each other. Which you think about it, it's hard to lose people, but at the same time easy to lose people. Erica: Just think about living here in the DC area. Your partner lived literally around the corner from you and you had never seen him ever in your entire life. I remember I ghosted a nigga that lived around the corner. I still ain't seen that nigga. Except one day I was walking down the street and heard a horn honk and I was like... Kenrya: Could be him. Erica: Could it be? But yeah. Yeah, so it's easy but difficult at the same time. Kenrya: I'm about to say, but then you got African Santa coming up to me and grabbing my hand in the middle of Safeway after I disappeared on him, so... Erica: Who was, again, every time I mention, I will mention that he was snowbese, meaning you weren't sure if it was a coat or his body. Kenrya: That was a thing. But that was not the thing. The thing was that this nigga was talking about how I was going to give him beautiful Black babies the first time we talked on the phone. Erica: Yeah. Oh my goodness. Okay, so I feel like men... I think I deleted the damn thread. I feel like men, they do this thing, especially in dating apps, where they talk... They try to be deep or they try to be doing too much and you be like, "Bruh." Kenrya: “Shut up.” Erica: “Shut the fuck up.” Okay, so I'm about to... So the nigga... So we matched. Kenrya: Yes, share. Yes. Let me get my dragon fruit smoothie. Erica: “Good morning, Erica, and Happy New Year. Looking through your profile, you seem eclectic and purposeful.” Kenrya: Shut up, nigga. Erica: “What part of your life are you most interested in growing in 2022? And is that part different than the most exciting part in your life?” Kenrya: What did you just say? Erica: I was like- Kenrya: What? Huh? Erica: So you know me, I'm trying, right? And I'm like, "You know what?" He didn't respond, because I realized I didn't have a full body pic, so I put a full body pic. And then when I put a full body pic, I kept getting like a [inaudible 00:39:17]. So I was like- Kenrya: You know what? Right. Erica: It wasn't that, so let's roll with it. So I'm not sure what we were... I responded like, "Oh, I have a lot going on, got a lot happening, hopeful about the new year." And so then I try to change it up, and I'm like, "So what's making you happy these days?" Because I just want to... No, I said, "What's bringing you joy these days?" Because I want to keep it light. I want to keep it light. He's like, "I'm always joyful. The joy has never left me." Kenrya: Oh, God. Erica: I said, "Okay, well what's making you happy?" "The fact that this conversation is going well is making me happy." Nigga. And you had locs, so why the fuck am I doing this? Kenrya: The "the joy has never left me" is giving me "I'm blessed" vibes. Erica: Yeah, “too blessed to be stressed.” Kenrya: Exactly. Erica: Amen. Okay, so I have this only because I screenshot this shit and send it to... I have a group of girlfriends that were always, "This one old nigga matched on me today. And do you know his fucking profile pic was a picture of him with Smokey Robinson?" He was like, "I'm going to flex on these hoes with Smokey. It was the worst." Okay. Kenrya: Oh. Erica: So, my response. So this is my response. This nigga is just like... Oh, I said, "What's making you happy?" He said, "I'm happy this banter is positive that we are crafting together." Kenrya: Oh, no, I'm sorry. Erica: So I said, "Look, so I'm not sure how to put this without a sounding shallow. So I guess it is, eye roll emoji. But typically when I initially match with someone, we get some sort of rapport before we jump in with the big questions. Right off the bat, it feels like an interview. You're probably a great guy, but this line of questioning feels like a lot before I'm sure there's even a spark." Erica: Are you proud of me? Kenrya: Yeah, that's very honest. What did he say back or did he unmatch after that? Erica: So then he's like, "Well, you can control the conversation." Wait, what did he say? Hold on. Because this... I'm going to see if I can find it. I think I deleted it because... Yeah, I deleted it. Yeah, I deleted it. But it was something along the lines of like... He was like, "Well, you can lead the conversation. You can try." And I'm like, "Bruh, I tried when I asked you what the fuck's bringing you joy. You could have said, 'Hey, I want some new sneakers or...'" Kenrya: “The sun is shining today.” Something, shit. Erica: Something, motherfucker. Everything ain't got to be deep, goddamn. And the thing is, as you all can tell listeners, I talk. If we hit it off? Nigga, you going to hear all my hopes and dreams. You going to hear about the one time in seventh grade I scratched my knee at the fucking friendship dance because my pants, they were the jeans with the suede, but then the suede and then... Anyway. You going to get all of that, right? But goddamn. Off the bat? Fuck. Nigga. It just... Ugh. Kenrya: Yeah, that's a lot. Erica: It's a lot. Kenrya: Well- Erica: And it's like- Kenrya: I don't know. For me, it's not... It just feels fake and forced. Erica: Yeah. And if that's who you are, then great. But that's not who I need to be with. I need to coon with you just a little bit before we... I need some kikis before we start jumping into the “what are your fucking hopes and dreams?” Kenrya: Because you want to know that it's somebody who you can ki with, right? Now's the time to be dazzling. Kenrya: My partner's always like, "Listen. Yeah, okay. I look how I look." But he's like, "But I'm funny." He was like... I mean, he's fine. But he's like, he always feels like because he's not the tallest man... He taller than me. You know I really don't give a fuck. But he always felt like... He has the opposite... Well, it's not even the opposite of a little man complex. He just doesn't give a fuck. But he does recognize that people treat him differently because he's not six foot. He was like, "So I've just always been fucking funny." He was like, "I bring my A material. I know what my..." He's like, "I'm going to dazzle you, so..." Erica: It ain't nothing wrong with that. Kenrya: That works, yeah. Listen- Erica: Partner, ain't nothing wrong with that. Kenrya: He had me laughing from the very beginning. That shit works. Erica: It's just like, "Bruh, you ain't got to do all that." And the entire time he's doing this, all I'm thinking is, "In front of my salad? In front of my fucking salad?" I don't know why that was in my brain, but it's like, "Nigga, you doing all this. Just chill. Tranquilo, tranquilo." That's what my brother say when I start coming in hot. He was like, "Tranquilo." Yeah. Erica: Okay. Damn, how did we get here? Kenrya: Oh, I don't know. Erica: Okay, so anyway. Yeah. So... Oh, lost and found niggas. Ugh, okay. Kenrya: Wait, lost and found niggas? Erica: Yeah, yeah. African Santa? Kenrya: Oh, God. Yeah, not being able to shake. Erica: Yeah, not being able to shake niggas. Yeah. So anyway, but yeah. I just, with the dating thing, it's just like, "Dog, just be yourself." And you know what? Maybe he was being himself. And then- Kenrya: Then that just means that his self was not for you. Erica: Exactly. But then this starts me down this rabbit hole because the nigga had locs and I told you I don't like people with long hair. And so I'm like, "Well, fuck. This is what you get for compromising on your I don't want to date niggas with long hair." But then it's like, "Bitch, chill the fuck out." Kenrya: He's one person. Erica: It's not like we talking about- Kenrya: He's not all the people. Erica: Exactly. So it just, it wasn't a good look. Okay, another theme in this story was that both Darren and Nadia were really super involved parents and they did it so much so that they failed to care for themselves. But what I found really interesting was that the other person made sure that the other person was taking care of themself. Does that make sense? Kenrya: I think so. Erica: And it was beautiful. It's part of those sweet little things that the couple did for one another. Erica: Okay, last thing. Part of what made these sex scenes fucking hot were how Katrina made it so that Jordan fueled Nadia's hunger for Darren. Or Jordan fueled Darren's hunger for Nadia. And that was so fucking sexy because they were like, "Look, I fucks with you hard. And I just saw her, and she made me hot, and I'm going to fuck with you even harder. And thinking about her and you and how you would enjoy her, then that makes me even hornier." It was just this whole... I'm thinking of those earth circles with the arrows of just hotness and sexiness. Kenrya: Yeah, and she was very intentional about that. Getting him worked up and then sending him home to his wife. When they were still in their dating before they were all together or whatever. Erica: But even when they were all together, because there was really only one scene where they were all together. Right? Kenrya: Two, yeah. Erica: Yeah, all right. Yeah. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: The dog. It was good. And so, and I think that that's something that's normal and healthy. And I think that couples should stop denying that part of themselves. I just think that... I don't want you fantasizing about your kid's school teacher while you're fucking me, because you could actually be fucking your kid's school teacher, right? But I don't think that there's anything wrong in recognizing that you're attracted to other people and maybe that ass makes me want to tear up that ass a little bit more. Because I feel like people deny that part of themselves and, "The only person I ever want to see and love and fuck is you." Erica: Mm, you probably had a... I mean that shit don't turn off immediately. And I'm not making an argument that people can't be monogamous or faithful or anything like that, but I am making the argument that when you get in a relationship, fucking- Kenrya: Your eyes don't close. Erica: ... attractions. Kenrya: You don't- Erica: Exactly. Kenrya: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Erica: Yeah, and so I think if we're all honest about that, then maybe that'll throw a little spice in some shit. You might be excited about... I remember I was fucking this guy and he would always talk about having threesomes. Not always, but I knew I could make him come when I was like, "Yeah, imagine you fucking a chick." It's fantasy, y'all. It's okay. I mean, granted they incorporate a little bit more, but it's fantasy. It's a part of the situation. I don't think it's a bad thing. Kenrya: No, I don't think it's a bad thing. It's interesting. I'm sitting here trying to think if I've ever fantasized... I don't know if I've ever fantasized about somebody else while I was with somebody. Erica: I do. I do enough for the both of us then. Kenrya: I don't think I have. Huh. I don't think I have. It doesn't mean, though, that I don't find other people attractive or anything like that. It's just not what I'm thinking about when I'm having sex with somebody. Huh. Erica: And that's fine. But there's some people do and that's fine. As long as we ain't... Kenrya: If you're not acting on it if that's not what your relationship is, then... Erica: As long as we ain't monogamous. Yeah, as long as... Yeah. Erica: So, yeah. That's all I got. Kenrya: Word. Erica: You got anything else? Kenrya: Just... Yes, this book is behind a Patreon pay wall. Totally fucking worth it. Erica: Totally worth it. Kenrya: And y'all know how we feel about supporting Black women and nonbinary folk in their work. And so... Erica: Do it. Kenrya: I don't really know what to tell... It's... Erica: It's good. Kenrya: It is so good. And not just the sex scenes. Katrina's a wonderful writer. Erica: Yes. Kenrya: We read a lot of books to find books for the show. Erica: Fucking on Bernie's bus. I will never get that shit out of my head. Kenrya: What? Erica: It is the equivalent of walking in on your parents having sex. Kenrya: You talking about the first book for the pilot that we scrapped? Erica: No, there was a book. I don't even... It was a book, and at some point in the story, these bitches was getting a train run on in Bernie Sanders' bus. Kenrya: Oh, God. Yeah, that's bad. I mean- Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: Ugh, yeah. A lot of stuff don't make it. Erica: A lot of stuff don't make it. Kenrya: But this one was- Erica: The ones that do? And this one is just- Kenrya: From beginning to end. Erica: She's great. I mean, we knew she was good with “Welcome to Seaport,” but this just... Kenrya: It's interesting too, because I see- Erica: Was this a short? Kenrya: ... the growth. I don't think so. Maybe. Erica: Yeah, I'm like, "I don't think so." Kenrya: I remember she said she was supposed to be writing shorts, but she kept writing full-length projects. Erica: Yeah. But yeah, it was fucking good. Kenrya: Yeah, really and truly worth it. Erica: So, please support our homegirl. Kenrya: Yeah. She's dope and this book is dope. And yeah, she'll be on next week. Erica: We'll see her next week. Kenrya: Yeah, so get to [crosstalk 00:52:08]. Erica: All right, y'all. Well, we about to take a break and then we'll be back with- Kenrya: What's turning us on. Kenrya: Hey, y'all. Today's a great day to start your own podcast. Whether you're looking for a new marketing channel, have a message you want to share with the world or just think it'd be fun to have your own show like us, podcasting is an easy, inexpensive, and fun way to expand your reach online. And Buzzsprout is hands down the easiest and best way to launch, promote, and track your podcast. Your show gets put online and listed in all the major podcast directories like Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google, literally everything, within minutes of finishing and uploading your recording. We use it here for The Turn On and I can truly attest to the fact that it's pretty fucking dope. Kenrya: Podcasting isn't hard when you have the right partners and the team at Buzzsprout is passionate about helping you succeed. So join over 100,000 podcasters like us who are already using Buzzsprout to get their message out to the world. Just click the link in our show notes and you'll be able to get your own account set up. And if you sign up for a paid plan, you'll get a $20 Amazon gift card and support our show. Let's create something great together. Sign up for Buzzsprout today. Kenrya: Hey, y'all. Erica: Okay, y'all. Kenrya: So, we're back. And this week for what's turning us on, I don't even know what episode it was. I was talking about how with my disability I have a little bit harder time with doing a lot of stuff. And one of those things that's a little tougher is sex. And it's mostly because I have to keep my heart rate low, because when it goes high things go wonky. Kenrya: And so I'm finding that the position that I'm in can have a huge effect on how much energy I'm expending and how high my heart rate goes. So when I stand up, my heart rate shoots up and my blood pressure drops down low. Not great. And so it means that you got to be careful when you're having sex. Erica: We like dropping it low, just not blood pressures low. Kenrya: Just not blood pressure, yes. And so, I've had this book sitting over here on my bookshelf. I've had this book for literal years. I can't even remember how long ago I bought this book. And it's funny because I was just opening it to look at it before we started talking. And it was cracking because I hardly ever open it, but when folks... Back when we were in our, I don't know, was it late-twenties, early-thirties when everybody was getting married? Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: And so a book, I used to... You know how I give books for gifts. And I would give folks two books, one for love and one for lust. So the one for love is this “Love Letters” book, and the one for lust has always been a copy of the “Kama Sutra.” Usually a really nice, beautifully illustrated. Mine is not as beautiful as theirs, but whatever. Kenrya: But so as I've been thinking about ways that I can help keep my shit and my heart rate low, I have been begrudgingly thinking about new positions. Because we know I have a favorite, but that takes so much energy. And so it has forced me to go to the old faithful Kama Sutra to find positions that are better suited for the body that I am currently in. And so I am recommending a thing that is turning me on. Kenrya: Oh, they sucking dick. Erica: Ayy. Kenrya: Is that you do some spring cleaning on your positions, right? We get stuck in- Erica: Oh, I was going to say that pussy. Kenrya: Oh, well, whatever organs you have. Erica: Spring clean that bussy. I see. Yeah, that bussy. Kenrya: So we get stuck in doing things in certain ways because it's the way that we know that we can get off and is what has worked for us for however long, whether it's with one partner or with all of our partners. Why not look into some new ways that you can get off? Whether it's because you need to, like me, or just because you want to try something new. You might find that there's some shit that you really, really like that you never thought that you should try just by looking in the Kama Sutra. So that's what's turning me on this week. Erica: Yay. Well, I like that, because I feel like we've all... I was looking back here because I'm like... Kenrya: You got a copy somewhere? Erica: I know I got a copy, and it probably came from you. Kenrya: Probably. Erica: Here's the problem. So I've been reading somewhere that there's this group called Room Raters. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: And they raid... They rate people's rooms. Kenrya: Uh-huh (affirmative). The folks who are doing TV and Zoom webinars and shit. Erica: And I have a friend who was like, "These motherfuckers took a point off." And I'm like, "Okay." But one of the things that they talk about is they don't like it when people have their books lined up according to color. And I do. Erica: Hold on, let me see if I can get my camera. Kenrya: Why not? Why they don't like that? Erica: I guess they say it means that you don't read them or something. Kenrya: But that's bullshit, because if you remember the cover then it helps you to be able to find. I know it's a blue book. Erica: And the only books that I can find are the books up there because I know the color of... I know what the... The menu. I know what the cover looks like, and then I know where to go. The rest of these motherfucking books, I literally got to be like... Kenrya: Right, that's stupid. That's like my closet is in... So after the last time that the fucking pole fell, when I finally put everything back up... Erica: Oh, shit. Kenrya: It's fallen three times. Erica: I'm sorry, YouTubers. Kenrya: And it's fell again. I don't even know why it fell this time because I replaced it with a metal pole instead of the cheap ass shit that was up there when I moved in. Anyway. But so my clothes are in color order now because it took me two fucking days to do it and get them up there. But it's just so much easier if I know that there's this particular black dress- Erica: “I'm going for yellow today.” Kenrya: Yeah, I can literally just go through all the fucking yellow. It's so much easier. People are wilin’. So, anyway. Erica: Well, anyway. Kenrya: Kama Sutra. Erica: All right, y'all. Well, thank you for joining us for another episode of The Turn On. This is Erica and Kenrya, your two favorite hoes making it clap. Kenrya: Bye. [theme music] Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Hit subscribe right now in your favorite podcast app and at YouTube.com/TheTurnOnPodcast, so you'll never miss an episode. Erica: Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. And you can find links to books, transcripts, guest info, what's turning us on, and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Kenrya: And don't forget to email us at [email protected] with your book recommendations and your pressing sex-and related questions. Erica: And you can support the show by leaving us a five-star review, buying some merch or becoming a patron of the show. Just head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to make that happen. Kenrya: Thanks for listening and we'll see you soon. Holla.
LISTEN TO THE TURN ON
Amazon Music | Apple Podcasts | Google Play | iHeart Radio | Pandora | Radio Public | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn | YouTube CONNECT WITH THE TURN ON Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | Goodreads | Patreon SHOW NOTES In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya talk to psychic Jamila White about fish dreams, the ways intuition shows up, how to practice energy hygiene, tapping into your own intuitive intelligence, setting boundaries with our ancestors and how connecting with your sensual self can help you get in touch with the rest of yourself. RESOURCES
The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information. TRANSCRIPT Kenrya: Come here. Get off. [theme music] Kenrya: Welcome back, good people. Today, we're talking to Jamila White, pronouns she and her. Jamila's a psychic medium, life coach, and Reiki master and teacher who helps people go from feeling off balance, fearful of the future, and stuck in a rut to experiencing the clarity, peace of mind, and freedom to live their lives and run their businesses with unconditional joy and purpose. Her intuitive consultations and Akashic records readings are empowering. They are empowering—hat's how you say that word—engaging, uplifting, and laugh out loud funny. Jamila's philosophy is one of empowerment. It's your life, your divine purpose and your choices. Her calling is to share insights to help you clarify your own path to enjoy fulfillment, and to help you recognize and develop your own gift of intuition. A Washington DC area native, and one time “Wheel of Fortune” contestant, Jamila is currently living her best life in Barbados while serving clients all over the world. Yay. Thank you so much for coming on spec. Jamila: Hey spec. Hey Erica. It's so nice to meet you. Thank you for having me. I'm excited. Erica: I know. So just a little background on The Turn On. We would not be here if it were not for Jamila, like yeah. In the beginning we were like, I don't know, is this an idea? Should we do it? And in addition to being our intuitive, Jamila is also just like fabulously gifted with all things, startup business, entrepreneurship, and internet. So yeah, when we got the "go on and do it, girl" from you, we were like, “Well, shit, I guess we've got to make this work.” Jamila: It's so good to see you all actually doing it. I'm so proud of you. I'm excited for you. This went from a conversation two or three years ago to here you are now, in what season four, season five of your podcast. Yeah, that's incredible. Yeah, do that thing. Do that thing. Erica: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Kenrya: Why did I not know you were on “Wheel of Fortune”? Jamila: You didn’t? Because it was before we met, was long before we met. I had just graduated from Howard. And the funny story about that, the short version is, they came to Howard during my senior year to recruit a team for their college episode. And they were going to include, because they were going to film it in Disney World, an all-expense paid trip to Disney World for a week. And that's what I wanted. So I auditioned with 200 other Howard students trying to get that free trip. And you know, they had all these rounds of elimination, and I made it down to the final 10, and I wasn't selected to be on the team of four, but as someone who made it that far through the process, they invited me back on the regular show at my own expense. And I was like, "Yeah, I am broke college student. See ya." Jamila: But later that summer after I graduated right before I started my full-time job, I was able to go out to L.A. and be on the show. And I came in last place. I knew the answer but every time it was not my turn. I would lose a turn, miss a turn, or it wouldn't be my turn to speak. I'm like, "That's not how it works at home. I can just yell at the TV," but I did win a little bit of money and some nice parting gifts. Erica: Like a refrigerator and a jet ski? Jamila: No like some Paul Mitchell hair products in a quote lifetime supply of Lifesavers candy, which basically translated to a $50 gift certificate from some random pick any item catalog. But you know. Erica: Really. Jamila: And every once in a while, it will pop up on a Game Show Network rerun, and I'll get a bunch of calls from people, "I think I just saw you on TV, but you had a perm." Oh yeah. Good times. Good times. Erica: I'm so mad at this lifetime supply, because I know they're not going to send you a check every week, but I would at least think they would give you, okay, you're going to eat a pack of Lifesavers every day for a week or so. Jamila: No. Well, apparently, they determined the value of a lifetime of Lifesavers as $50 in the ’90s so that's what it would've been. And then they said, "We're going to give you a gift of the equivalent." So I was able to pick some things from a catalog, and I ended up picking a cooler and a three-way flashlight. I mean, it was weird stuff. Erica: It's like shit when you're selling, like when you sell a cookie catalog. Jamila: That was exactly. And I got about $1,300, but once the taxes came out and then I paid for the trip out to Los Angeles from D.C. Yeah, the money, it wasn't much. Kenrya: Oh. Jamila: When I was out there, there was another soror on the show, my sands from Delta Chapter, who I met, and we were so excited because they filmed a week at a time. Erica: At a time. Jamila: And you had to just change clothes and pretend like you saw some people yesterday, but you're sequestered with these people all day, like a jury. So you really get to know them, and you start really rooting for them like, "Oh my God, Becky is about to win $35,000, get it in." You know? So yeah, it was fun. Erica: That's cute. Jamila: And so me and the soror that I just met, we had an extra day or two, because we both lost. So we were able to hang out in Los Angeles and Hollywood, and we ran into one of the guys from Tony, Toni, Toné at Popeye's Chicken. At the time, they were like a big hot group. This is like 1994. Why are we talking about this? Erica: This is such a '90s story. I love it. Jamila: Why are we talking about this? Erica: Because I'm nosy. Jamila: Oh yeah. But it was fun. It's just one of those things, and it's like, "Wait, you did what?" Because people always expect me to say yes and she studied this foremost spiritual, such and such, and oh, that's some boring bullshit. Yeah, I was on “Wheel of Fortune,” and I feel like that's one of my best life accomplishments, even though I came in last. Erica: Yeah. It's certainly fun. Jamila: And it's funny, I didn't solve any puzzles. So everybody else was getting money, and my thing was still at $0, and it was the last puzzle, and it was a speed round, and it was the last thing. And I guessed the letter P and it turned out to be “a handicapped parking space.” It had a whole bunch of Ps in it. So I guessed, and that's how I got some money. Because at that point I was like, "Please don't let me go home with no money. I will never live this down. I can't be on this show. My grandmother's going to be watching. And I came home with zero money, plus I ain't started my job yet. I had to pay for this trip." Kenrya: Yeah. So it worked out. Jamila: It worked out, it was one of those things. Yeah. And Pat Sajak stood on a box. He's very small. Erica: He looks like he's a tiny tot. He looks like he's a short king. Kenrya: Okay. Erica: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Kenrya: Did I know? Erica: Okay. Well that was a great non sequitur. Was that a non sequitur? Kenrya: Yes. Erica: Okay. I just like using words. Okay. So let's jump in. What were the prevailing attitudes about sex and gender in your home growing up, and how do you think that impacts the way you move through the world? Jamila: Now sex was another story. It really wasn't talked about in my household, at least not with me as the youngest child. And I remember when I was four-ish, I must have been asking my mom a lot of questions about how babies get made, and where babies come from. And she bought me a very detailed elaborate book for children called, “Where Babies Come From” or “How Babies Are Made,” or something like that. And I read that book from cover to cover. I memorized it. I looked at all the pictures, and to this day, I could tell you about the pictures in the book. It was a hippie type book. They were trying to show the stages of body development. So they had a whole family standing side by side, buck naked. These hippie white people with long black hair and all body hair never shaved in no places. Jamila: And I was just fascinated by these people. It was from kids all the way up to the adults. And I could be looking at these pictures like, "Wow." And I remember thinking, they talked about how babies get made, and that the way that fertilization occurs is that people are, at the time, when they're having sex, they're not really thinking about making a baby. And I'm thinking, "How could you actually be doing that and not think that you're making a baby? You didn't just fall on somebody's penis. So how do you not be thinking about you're not making a baby." I just could not understand that process. Okay, if you're putting food in your mouth, you're thinking I'm eating. So how are you putting something in your body, and not thinking I'm making a baby. Kenrya: Smarter at four than a lot of grown folks. Jamila: At that age, I was just like, the connection of why somebody would be having sex except to procreate, like I said, four or five was just beyond me. So growing up, my mom didn't really talk about sex that much at that time. At the time, she was going through her own evolution as a woman, as a parent, as a spiritual being. At the time, she was a Capitol Hill staffer. We grew up in the D.C. area, only wore Ann Taylor type clothing and only wore pumps. I don't think I ever saw my mom in flats ever or sneakers ever at that time. And what's funny now is she's this barefoot earth model, mother goddess, age 76. And for the last like 30 years, 40 years, she's been a holistic healer, a birth doula, massage therapist, a Reiki master, aroma therapist, reflexer, all these things, in the eighties when nobody knew what that shit was. Jamila: And I was just like, what is that? People were like, "Is your mom in a cult?" because she was doing aromatherapy. Now, you can go to Walmart and get aromatherapy, and at Target. Erica: Yeah. Jamila: But in the eighties, it was like, "What are you smelling? What is that? Are you getting high off that lavender oil? What is she doing to her children?" So my mom was just very into all of that stuff back then. It's a different world now, but people were not into all that. So she was ahead of her time and not just with that, but with how she chose to live her life, picking up and moving my freshman year, moving out of state, to follow her heart. And I look at that now and understand that what she was teaching me was how to be free. Jamila: She wasn't teaching it to me like, "Sit down, and this is what I want to tell you," but just how she chose to live her life, even when other people were being very judgmental about her choices, "How are you going to leave your city and your daughter is off to college?" She was like, "Well, I'm done now. Deuces. At the time, I can't say I was happy about it, but I look at that now and how I choose to live. I mean, I picked up and moved to Barbados, and I can't pretend that seeing how my mother picked up and enjoyed her life, played a part in some of my choices about pursuing what makes me happy and making joy a priority. That is so huge for me. I know what it is like to not live with joy, to live in depression and anxiety and clinical, this and that. Jamila: So living with joy intentionally and not just trying to find some joy after I've done everything else, that matters to me, across the board in terms of how I choose to work, how I choose to live, how I choose to love. It's all about that. Erica: All right. So Jamila? Jamila: Yes. Erica: What did you want to be when you grew up? Jamila: Ooh, I was one of those kids that wanted to be like five different things at once. I would tell people a cheerleader and a veterinarian and a parapsychologist. This was after the “Ghostbusters” movie came out, the first one, a gymnast. At age four, I wanted to own a toy store, and that was what set me on a path to entrepreneurship at such an early age, because I did two years in corporate America coming out of college. The first year I was really trying to do corporate America. The second year I was running my part-time business and planning my exit. So it took one year for me to realize, "Oh, this is not for me. This is environment." I liked the work, but I felt like I was pigeonholed into being a specialist when I am built to do multiple things simultaneously. That's part of my makeup. Jamila: But at age four, my mom and dad were considering buying a small, independent toy store. And so my mom worked part-time in the toy store to learn the ropes. And so she would bring me in there from time to time. And I just remember walking up and down the aisles with toys, upon toys, upon toys. I'm four, I'm like, "You could have a job in here, and people can pay you to come in here and be with toys, sign me up." And from that point on, I wanted to own a retail store. And my first business was in ecommerce retail, but it was because I was literally trying to open a store, a physical store on Georgia Avenue, and the internet was a brand new thing. And I ended up opening an online shop in 1997 when nobody was even on the internet. We still had dial up that made loud, screechy noises. Jamila: And most people weren't on the web per se. They were mostly like in AOL, which had a contained community. There weren't any examples. The shopping cart software that we have now that does like 800 things, that did not exist. It did one thing, and it was very expensive. And I had a knuckle buster credit card machine with those old carbon copy things. And I was mostly doing vending. And then I was doing the ecommerce, but it all stemmed from my desire to own a retail store that was planted at age four. And then, came back up at age 20 when I was pledging Delta and met my linesister, Carol, who at age 21, owned a store in Adams Morgan as a full-time college student. And I was just like, "Wait, you own the what?" "I own the dance shop." Jamila: And I just remember, I met her at the Rush. Long story, we were standing in the corner, trying not to eat the food and talking to each other, for reasons that I can't go into at this time. And we were getting to know each other. Because there was some other women that I knew there, but I didn't know her, so we were getting to know each other. And she mentioned that she owned a store, and my mouth was on the floor. I'm like, "What do you mean you own a store?" And it changed my whole perception of life in that instant and of who I was. Because up until that time, I knew I wanted to be an entrepreneur. But for some reason, in my mind, you had to be 40 and have done something for 20 years. And then you stopped doing that and then do it for yourself. Even though I had entrepreneurs in my family, nobody used that word. Jamila: I came from a line of entrepreneurs. My grandmother on my dad's side, had a house cleaning business, and sold clothes out the back of her car, and bought herself a Cadillac in Greenville, North Carolina. And she would drive up to New York and spend time the school year in New York and summers and back in her hometown in Greenville, North Carolina. And that was a big deal. She had a fourth-grade education, but she was able to earn her own living. So even though I had that in my family, and then my dad had started some consulting businesses off and on between that and him working in corporate America, I did not see myself as an entrepreneur. That's what older experienced people do. Jamila: And here comes this young woman, who we are basically the same age. She's not even a business major. She was a psychology major. And she's telling me she owns a store in Adams Morgan, which for people outside the D.C. area, this is a major commercial strip, very Soho. It was a major commercial strip with stores upon stores, upon stores on the street. And she had a shop, and at that moment, I was like, "If she could do it, I can do it. I don't know how she did it. I'm going to find out how she did it. But if she can do it, I can do it." Little did I know that two years later I'll be starting my own business, but it changed my whole world in that moment. Jamila: We all in life have these seminal moments where fate happens, and it changes something for you. And it puts you on a trajectory that you may not have been on. I think I would've eventually been an entrepreneur, but definitely not at age 22, 23 going full time, but when I saw that Carol could do it, and she kept that store open for several years. It wasn't easy. She busted her butt, but she had a bunch of us working in there part-time for free. But she did it, and I never looked at myself the same again after that. Kenrya: Mm, yeah. Jamila: I was like, "I can do this." Kenrya: And you are. You talked just a moment ago about those seminal moments. I'm wondering, when did you come into your intuitive self? Jamila: Ooh, that's a good question. I was intuitive as a kid, although I wouldn't have used that word. I remember my first recollection of knowing that I knew something, I was probably maybe nine-ish, and we went to visit family, friends in New Jersey for Easter. And for Easter dinner, we were all sitting around the table and somebody said, "Pass the salt or something like that." And I froze, because I was just like, "Oh my God," because I had seen that whole scene play out with the same people, some of which I didn't know until that day, sitting at that same table in that same order. And someone had said, "Pass the salt," but I didn't even realize that I had seen it already, until it happened. And I'm like, "Nobody else knows that this already happened," and I'm looking around and everybody's just going about their business. Jamila: And I knew that I had seen something, that I had already seen it before it happened. And it wasn't significant. Nothing happened during that dinner. It was very uneventful, except for the fact that I had seen it already. And after that, I kept asking my mom questions about what is deja vu. That's the only word that I knew to describe it. I didn't know about clairvoyance and whatever. I kept saying, "What is deja vu?" This feeling that you've already been somewhere. And she said shortly after that, I asked her and she said, this is the word I used. She said, I asked her for a book on the occult, because I went to the library to look up everything I could about to try and understand myself, and what had happened. And it probably had happened before, but that was the first time I was fully aware that something had occurred, and that nobody else saw it. Jamila: And that I would have these little flashes like that of scenarios. And usually they weren't significant. They were just, if you happen to just fast forward through a movie, you pause in a random place, but nothing major is happening in the plot, it was like that. Kenrya: Hmm. Jamila: And I began to devour everything I could. I would read about astrology and dream symbolism. And I was big in astrology and palm reading. And I got a Ouija board, even though we all did what people did with it, and pretend like we're moving it ourselves. And, I started reading about past lives. I was fascinated about past lives. Kenrya: Hmm. Jamila: I also had my own past life memories come up, also around that same age, maybe even a little bit younger, but still not having the vocabulary to explain what I was experiencing, even though it was a traumatic past life memory. I think I was maybe seven or eight, and I was at my dad's, and we were watching the movie, “Roots,” the TV mini series, and the Middle Passage scene was so disturbing to me. And it wasn't just because it was a disturbing thing about people being enslaved and brutalized and trafficked essentially. Jamila: But I knew that I had done that. It wasn't like I'm watching this on TV, and it's disturbing me. It's like, "Oh no, I've done that. I remember this. I remember being chained. I remember being condensed like sardines," and I began to vomit, and I could not explain. And I was having nightmares and I could not explain to my dad or anybody else that I had seen it before. They just thought I was disturbed by a disturbing scene. But I could not explain that, "No, I know this. I was there, and I know what happens in this environment. I can feel it in my body." I could not explain that at that age. Jamila: Yes, I had a past life memory develop. I didn't have the vocabulary, and I didn't have anybody to even explain to me what that was at that time. So early on, I had these glimpses, but it wasn't until I was an adult, that things began to come all the way out, to where it was more detailed and was more messages about people. And when I was maybe 22-ish, 23, I had been out of college for a little while. And I remember having this very intense dream where there was all these minnows, like a school of minnows, thousands and thousands of minnows swimming. And I just happened to mention it in a conversation on the phone with my mom, and she said, "Oh, you had a fish dream." Jamila: And I was like, "Yeah, like I said, it was all these fish." She said, "No, no, no, you had a fish dream. That's a thing." And I'm like, "What are you talking about?" I had never heard of that before. And she said, "Your grandmother and great-grandmother used to have those. And that they also just knew things." And that was her way of saying that they, too, were intuitive. And at this point I'm like, "What are you talking about?" I had never heard that before about them and that not only that, but my great-grandmother could look at people and know stuff. And my mother said, "One day they were all sitting at the dinner table and her grandmother looked at her and said, "You're pregnant now." She and my dad had just found out, and they hadn't told anybody yet. And my great-grandmother just knew. She looked at her, she was like, You're pregnant." She also used to have fish dreams and know other things. And I didn't think that much of it. I was like, "Okay, whatever. That's some folklore, some urban myth stuff ." Jamila: Until, over the next two months, about eight of my friends, most the Delta sorors, revealed that they were pregnant. And I was like, "What are you saying?" Because that's what fish dreams mean is somebody is pregnant or is about to be. And then every time I had a fish dream after that, I would let people know, and sure enough, this outpouring of how did you know or next thing someone got pregnant. And then the dream started getting more and more specific. You know, someone had a gold and black fish, and then they got pregnant by an Alpha. Someone else had a fish swimming in a fountain, and someone was throwing cigarette butts in the fountain. And then the person goes, "Oh, I'm pregnant. And me and my boyfriend, fiancé just had a big fight about him smoking around me when I'm pregnant." Like all of this very detailed stuff started coming. Jamila: And then I had some other life experiences in the years that followed that, that brought my intuition way out to the front to where the curtain, I would say, between this world and the spirit world was pulled back completely. And I could go back and forth between those two worlds, and the spirit world could go back and forth with me and share information and insights for people. I never thought even as my intuition was growing, that I would be able to say, "Yes, at three o'clock next Friday, I'm going to sit down with you for an hour and just start telling you all these things." That never even occurred to me that, that was a possibility. Jamila: I was just trying to understand my own life. And I began to start reading about intuition and spirituality and all of these other things. And then the Spirit brought someone into my life around that time. And it's a friend of a friend from Howard, someone I knew, but we weren't real close. This is somebody that I knew. And she called me. At the time, I was still working in internet consulting and internet strategy and marketing. I had that full time business doing that. And she called me to interview you me for a magazine. She was a freelance writer, and she was interviewing me for “Black Enterprise” to talk about some of this ecommerce stuff. And after the 20-minute interview, we sat in Starbucks, we talked for three hours about metaphysics and intuition and spirituality. Then, we became like best friends. Jamila: And then we would go to places, Starbucks and Outback and other restaurants, and Jaspers, which also was BET Downstage at one point, and we would be playing intuitive games and trying to channel and sometimes messing with cards and stuff. And people would be looking at like, "What are they doing?" And what I did not understand at the time, because had Spirit said, "We are training you to become a professional psychic," I would've run screaming from the room. But essentially what that was, was intuitive drills and those quote fun games in Starbucks took me to a place where I could be intuitive on demand. Jamila: And it also taught me that it's a skill, like anything else, it's a muscle, it can be taught, and it can be strengthened, and everybody has it. And you can always get better from where you are. And if you practice, you strengthen that muscle, and it's something that's accessible to everyone. And everyone may not end up being a professional psychic and doing readings for other people, but everyone, every person has the gift of intuition that they can strengthen. And that is Spirit's way, God's way, of sharing with you, information and insights and guidance to help you live your best life. And it isn't always about having a whole vision and being clairvoyant and seeing people sitting around at Easter table, but it's about pick up the phone and call this person, or take a different route to work today, or go to this event, or leave that person alone. Okay. Jamila: We've all had that, leave this person alone. And it wasn't even based on something you observed or saw, but it was a feeling, but you ignored it, and you know what happened. We've all done it. So we all have intuition. We all have this inner compass, this spiritual compass. And part of I feel my purpose in life is to help people tap into their own intuition, their own guidance, and more importantly, learn how to trust it. We all recognize it, but sometimes we are not sure of it until after the fact, hindsight is 20/20 and it's like, "Oh, I knew I shouldn't have done that, or I knew I should have done that." And then you missed an opportunity, because you didn't follow that intuition. Jamila: And so I feel when you are plugged in, and it isn't even like, "Oh, let me be intuitive now." But just when you're really plugged in, it's just a flow that you have of being able to navigate through life, even if you don't have the entire blueprint about what's going to happen in your life. You're like, "Okay, I feel very strong from the inside that this is my next move." And then you have to trust it and act on it. That's where people mostly get stuck is on the trusting and acting on it part. Kenrya: Right. So you were just detailing some of the ways, the milestones of things that happened along the way as your intuition developed. I remember once you did, I think it was a post, I think it was a series of posts, about the different ways that intuition shows up. Can we talk about that? Jamila: Sure. Kenrya: That was really, oh, it was a workshop or something that you did. Jamila: It was a workshop. Kenrya: It made me understand. You've always told me I was intuitive, but it helped me to understand some of the ways that I was picking up on things without realizing it. Can you talk about the ways that intuition shows up? Jamila: Sure. So there are so many ways that people can be intuitive. There's so many different types of intuitive intelligence and being able to see things or clairvoyance, which literally means clear seeing, is just one of them. People may hear things. They may hear voices or hear words or sounds or music. People may feel things in their body, such as I get a tingle in my arm, or the hair on the back of my neck stands up, or I get this weird feeling in the pit of my stomach, or my left eyebrow will start throbbing. That can show up differently for different people. Or they may just know things. Suddenly, they just know. They didn't know before, now, they just know. There's an actual word for that called claircognizance. Kenrya: That I have. I just know shit, you know what I mean. Jamila: I don't know how I know, I just know, right? Exactly, claircognizance. And some people even have intuitive sense of smell and intuitive taste, where they can smell and taste things that don't physically exist. I didn't know that was a thing either. And I could not understand at one point why I kept smelling roses. I thought I had like hugged an old lady and had rose perfume on me. But I realized, I had not left the house that day. My clothes are clean. I was working at home in my basement, in my basement office. This was back when I was doing marketing, and I could not understand. Later, I began to understand over time, as they were revealing themselves to me, that both my great-grandmother was coming through, and that was her way of being around. Jamila: And also I had a spirit guide that always worked with roses. She worked with rose oils and rose petals and rose essence. And she actually later helped me start a business making bath and body products and using aromatherapy and flower essences and all this other stuff. And that was like a co-creation between me and a spirit guide. But I didn't know that the way that they were beginning to introduce themselves to me, that I could feel their presence around me. I could literally smell them. Kenrya: I get that, too. That's people who've gone on and how I know they visited. Jamila: I did not know that was a thing. You experience that with some people because you smell someone's perfume. Yeah. They're perfume or their body scent or cigar smoke. Or some people could say like, "I don't know what this means, but I'm smelling salt water." "Well, yeah, lady, I just moved to Barbados, so I live by the beach." Jamila: So people don't realize how intuitive they are, if they think that intuition just means having visions. And once you begin to explain that there are all of these different kinds of intuitive intelligences, they realize, "Oh, I am more intuitive. And I've been getting information and input all this time, but didn't recognize it. And now that I know that there are these different ways, I'm much more aware of when my intuition is really kicking in for me." And it may not have anything to do with being clairvoyant. All of the psychics and most movies and television are all clairvoyant. They see things, or they are a medium, and they talk to dead people. That's another whole other category of things. Jamila: But so many of us are walking around as empaths, people who are highly sensitive to energy, to other people's vibes. You know, they may not know the word empath, but they understand vibes. This person got a funky vibe or how they feel drained after being around certain people, very easily drained. People, there are so many empaths in our community who don't know that they're empaths. And because they don't know that, they don't know how to use that to help themselves and others. They also don't know how to protect themselves from being overwhelmed by other people's energy. And there is, in my view, an epidemic of anxiety, depression among empaths, intuitives and highly sensitive people, because they don't know that they are picking up on everybody else's shit, and walking around with it. Jamila: So just like we have daily physical hygiene practices, we wash our ass every day, we brush our teeth every day. We wash our bodies, we wash our hair at certain intervals because we're not even saying I'm going to wash my hair to remove the dust from this day. It's just a general practice. We need energy hygiene practices, because we are constantly picking up energy debris from other people. Most people are wondering, questions that I get about how do I keep negative spirits and demons off me? Like you have to be about demon. You need to be worried about the everyday people that you are interacting with in your home, in your office, in your community, on the subway, just like you can pass someone's energy. You can feel someone's energy, and not realize it, just because you passed them on the street, if you're very sensitive. And you don't say, "Oh, now I am feeling that man in the blue coat's energy." You say, "Oh, dang, suddenly, I'm so tired. Suddenly I feel so irritated." It does not register that this belongs to this other person. Jamila: Because the true definition of empath is you feel it as if it is your own. We also have all of these children who are empaths who don't realize that they are picking up other people, feelings and vibes, and their parents don't realize it either. And they're so sensitive and they don't know how to manage it. It's overwhelming. It can manifest as depression. It can manifest as being distracted. It can manifest as being anxiety. You think that kids can't feel the worldwide fear around the pandemic of the last two years. They don't have to be watching the news to feel everyone's fear, to feel the fear of racism, the feel of fear of all the different things that are going on. And so I bring this up, because when you know that you're carrying all this shit, you can then take steps to release it and to cleanse yourself of it. Jamila: If you're walking through a construction zone on the street, you're going to have a hard hat, and you're going to get all this dust and debris that's falling, and some of it's going to get on you. And at the end, you need to wash all that stuff off. Every day, intuitives and sensitives and empathic people are walking through a construction zone of dust and debris, and they don't know to clean it off. And what do you think the cumulative effect of that is, not to mention dealing with your own shit. We got our own shit. Jamila: There's also sexual energy debris. Be mindful about who you not just swapped body fluids with, but that is such an intimate energy exchange. And I'm all for grown people doing what grown people want to do when it is consensual, but you need to be mindful of your energy hygiene. And what are you walking around with after you have engaged in a very intimate act, which doesn't always have to be intercourse, but it definitely intercourse is one of the most intimate acts that there is, what are you doing to cleanse your energy after you've connected with someone, especially if this is someone who is not your partner? Kenrya: What can you do? Jamila: But is just for whatever. In these situations and in all situations, good energy hygiene, it's simple. If this is one of those things where a little bit on a consistent basis does a lot. It's not like a big splash thing, "Oh my God, I have to go somewhere special, pay somebody thousands of dollars for energy cleaning." It is one of the easiest things that people can do is use salt. Salt water bath, salt water ocean, salt water scrub in the shower. I keep a Himalaya bar of salts in my shower. And just like I wash my body with cleansers and soap. I also wet my hands on the bar. And then pass that over my body, pretty much daily because of the work that I do. Some people like smudge or sage. Some people have forms of holy water, Florida water. There's no wrong thing. It's what works for you. Some people use specific Bible verses and prayers of protection and cleansing. Jamila: So this isn't so much about, I have to find the right tool. This is about what can I incorporate into my daily or regular practices, if not daily then weekly to release other people's energy off of me. Because first of all, I've got my hands full dealing with my own shit. I don't need to be dealing with everybody else's shit that I done passed on the street. Right? Or kissed or whatever. Jamila: And so I'm a big fan of salt, because it's so accessible. It's so affordable, and it's so easy. You don't have to think real hard to do it. An Epsom salt bath will do a whole lot. If you want to add herbs and aromatherapy, I mean, go right ahead. But here's how, you know if it works, again, there's no right or wrong way. You know it works, because you'll feel differently afterwards. You will feel lighter afterwards. Not just, oh, I feel clean, and my skin feels soft, but you're actually going to feel lighter. That's how you know it's working. There're two parts of that. There's the hygiene part, which is cleaning up stuff at the end of the day, at the end of the week, at the end of whatever, at the end of an interaction. Jamila: But then there's the prevention part, and prevention is about grounding, grounding yourself so that things are less likely to stick on you in the first place. Grounding can be as simple as having a breathing practice, or a journaling practice, or an exercise practice, or go outside and nature practice, or a meditation or yoga practice. But it's something that gets you grounded and centered and brings you back into your body and into your breath. And even one minute a day in the morning goes such a long way to keep other people's shit off of you, so that you don't have to do as much cleaning. If you do the grounding, you can do less cleaning. But if you're spending all your time, cleaning, cleaning, cleaning, you probably need to be more grounded to start with. And maybe you need to reevaluate some of your life choices about who is around you and what environments you are in. Boundaries. Boundaries go into environments and people. We have choices about who and where we surround ourselves. Kenrya: We asked you to come on the show, because the story that we read last week is called “A Private Affair.” And the protagonist, whose name is Riley, is a woman who's been through some past relationships that have shaken her ability to trust, not just other people, but more importantly, herself. And you talked a little bit earlier about how a lot of times we have trouble trusting ourselves, trusting our intuition, trusting our gut. What are some things that you've seen that stand in the way of some Black women following our intuition? Jamila: Mm. People pleasing, wanting to do things that would make someone else approve of us or to do them in a way that is acceptable to other people. That stands in the way of so many people and their intuition, Black women, especially, but all people. That is so high up there, because what would so and so think, or what would they think, or what would it look like if I did this, even though my intuition is saying quit that job or change your career, I'm a lawyer, but I really want to be a sex educator. What would they think? Erica: Yeah. Jamila: That is a dream killer, trying to please other people, trying to be acceptable to other people. That will get you nowhere fast. And it is in direct conflict with your intuition. Another really big one is gas lighting. So gas lighting, and this is when another person tells you that your experience is not real. And this happens a lot in dating and relationships where there's an unhealthy dynamic, and someone is controlling, or manipulative, or narcissistic, or abusive. They will tell you that something that you did not experience didn't happen. Not just that they can't relate, they will make you think you're crazy, and that it is all in your head. And what happens over time is, and it's intentional on their part, is if you don't trust yourself, you don't know up from down. You can't prove that they're not respecting you, because, again, that's in your head. Jamila: Oh, you're being too emotional, being so sensitive, that never happened. In my very early dating life, I witnessed something with my own two eyes and had someone tell me that it never happened, and that they were so insistent about it and controlling about it, that I started to believe, to wonder did I actually see it. And then, over time, it doesn't just happen once. But it's over time, it begins to erode your sense of trust in yourself. And so not only do you not even trust your intuition, which is telling you to get the hell out of this relationship, but you don't even trust anything. You don't trust, can you manage your money properly? Because this person has told you that you spend too much or this, that, and the other. They'll tell you that this didn't happen, that they weren't at this place when you drove by and saw their car there, didn't happen. Jamila: And now you begin to question what is real, and I talk to so many women. I've experienced that, so then later on when I began to have that feeling again, that very specific kind of anxious, feeling that clingy, anxiousness feeling, because I'm not a naturally clingy person. When I felt that, I knew that whoever I was dealing with was operating out of integrity in a very big way. And I did not need to know the specifics. That alone was enough. When you have intuition, you don't need proof. When you have proof, you don't need intuition. My intuition was enough to know that I don't need to be dealing with this person. And matter of fact, I'm out. Peace. It was great knowing you, but I need to move in another direction. Oh, but why? Well, I just have a feeling that you're not being straight with me, and you're not operating in integrity. Oh, but I'm not doing anything. You know what, okay. I don't even need to prove to them or argue with them about what they're doing. Kenrya: Mm. Jamila: All right. Kenrya: Love that. Jamila: I'm gone. Erica: So what are some things we can do to reconnect with our intuition, particularly in regard to relationships? Jamila: The first is having a relationship with yourself. And before you introduce any other person into yourself, but having that relationship with yourself. So you know what is real for you, and being able to understand and hear your own voice, so that when somebody else is in your ear, be a lover of somebody else, saying this, that and the other, you can distinguish between what feels right to you and what doesn't, which has nothing to do with logic and fact. There's a role for logic, but what we're talking about is this doesn't feel right. Something doesn't feel right or the opposite issue. Jamila: This isn't just about avoiding pain and manipulation and someone who is controlling. It's also about moving towards the right people, the people who are aligned and compatible and good for you. This feels right, which is different than this feels good physically, although that can be part of it. This is, this feels right. This feels easy. This feels smooth. This feels aligned. And without having to convince ourselves, because that's what we do when we like somebody, is we start to convince ourselves that they're the right person, as opposed to observing their behavior over time. Jamila: Trusting that, even with intuition guiding you towards or away from someone, the power of observation and time are so important. Especially when you're learning to trust your intuition, you can have an intuitive feeling and then just lay back and observe, sit back and observe, what are they doing? Not what are they saying, what are they doing? One of the things that trips us up so much, and especially if you are an empath. The kiss of death are these words, but we feel so connected. If you find yourself saying that, full stop. Because usually when you're saying that, you're saying that in response to justifying some other behavior that they're doing, that did not feel good. And you're trying to justify why you should put up with that, because you feel so connected, and you've convinced yourself that this might be your soul mate or whatever, whatever, whatever. When you hear those words come out of your mouth or in your head, full stop. Jamila: Take a step back and reevaluate your situation, because you're usually trying to prove something to yourself. And if you got to prove something to yourself, it ain't it. Or it's it, but you're coming from a place of woundedness, and you won't be able to participate in a healthy way in that situation. But usually, because that ain't it. But we feel so connected. Okay. So he has a wife already, and you're telling me that you feel so connected. Okay, well that's great. He could be your soulmate. He could be your future husband, but not while he already has got a wife. So if he cares about you, he'll handle his business, leave his relationship with integrity, since he says, "It's almost over anyway." And you can wait. And I don't mean by waiting, sit on the sidelines. Jamila: But before you connect yourself to this person that you feel so connected with, who is in a monogamous relationship, but wanting to deal with you, let him handle that, and how he comes to you, says everything about how he's going to treat you. I mean, sometimes marriages end, and sometimes the world is not as neatly wrapped up in a bow. It's a timing of things. And I'm not saying everybody go out and find themselves a married man. But I'm saying that sometimes you meet your person before they've wrapped up their other relationship, but how they handle that transition, speaks volumes to their integrity, and speaks volumes to whether they've done the work on themselves to be fully present as a partner to you. Right? So I don't even know how we got on that part about the... Oh, but we feel so connected. Okay. Jamila: So when I hear somebody say that and as an empath, this is so important. It took me again. I was in my forties when I had the aha moment, that all my life I've been dating as an empath and that there are some specific things that come with that, that other people don't experience. For example, as an empath, and I don't even mean as a professional psychic, but just as an empath, sensitive to vibes, you can often feel that the other person is genuinely attracted to you. You can feel that they want to be something to you, that they want to be your superhero, that they want to offer you something, a relationship or whatever. Jamila: You can feel that, that's what they want. You can feel the energy of that. However, you are not to act on that. That's to acknowledge, I feel this, I feel his attraction for me. Okay. But what is he doing? What's he doing? Not, what's he saying? Because he might be articulating the attraction, "Girl, I want to do this for you. And I've been thinking about having a woman in my life, just like you." And he may be saying these things, but what is he doing? What is he showing you consistently over time? There is no substitute for time. Right? Because it feels so good, and then these same folks will be the first to say we feel so connected. Kenrya: God, and then you fill in the blank. Lord, have mercy. Oh, I've been there. Jamila: Feelings are great. Vibes are great. Journal it down, write down what you observed and get it out, but never substitute that for observing the behavior, and how they are moving towards you with actions on a consistent basis. Because anybody could be your hero for a week. Anybody could be the man for a week, a month. Maybe even three. Someone once told me it takes 90 days before someone shows their true color, and you really get to see the person and not the quote representative of the person. And maybe there's some truth to that. I mean, I don't know that there's a hard time frame, but when I get calls from clients who want to know, if this person is their soul mate and it's like, y'all have known each other for two days, "Is this my guy? Is he the one?" It's been two days. Don't spend your money asking that. Don't spend your money to ask me that. Kenrya: Or are they ready to do the work to get there. Jamila: And that's fine. That's fine. Erica: So in the book that we read, the protagonist Riley, she used masturbation as a form of meditation to tap into her confident self. How can getting in touch with our sensual selves help us get in touch with other parts of ourself? Jamila: Ooh, that's such a juicy question. That is such a juicy question. I think, well, first of all, self care and pleasure of any kind is a good thing. Secondly, sexual energy is really powerful. And when people are experiencing stagnation in their lives as a whole or in any area of their lives, the solution to stagnation is flow, to get the energy moving, and the energy is stuck. Whether it's money, because all money is energy. If money is stuck, if your money is not flowing like you want, you have to get your energy unstuck. You don't have a money problem. You have an energy problem. So if orgasm and self pleasuring is the way to get the flow, it literally increases your blood circulation, and it moves energy. If that's part of the way that you care for yourself, if that's how you stay in touch with yourself, that's how you love on yourself. If that's also how you achieve flow in one area of your life, that transfers into other areas of your life. It can. Jamila: So if you're stuck in one area of your life, get unstuck. Sometimes it's through creativity and play. Sometimes it's through sexual energy. Sexual energy is a really powerful thing, because at its core, sexual energy is the energy of creation. It is what created this world. It is what keeps the population going in this world is sexual energy, whether it is used for procreation or used for intimacy, bonding, or whether it's used for self pleasure, that energy when released allows other things to move through. It literally helps with anxiety and depression. So I'm all for it. I think that people need to be encouraged, and give themselves permission to explore their sexuality with themselves and with the partner, when they feel safe. Your sexual energy is there for you to harness and to use how you want to, and whether that's partner sex or solo sex. It's a gift. And if you want to see somebody who is uptight and often stagnant in different areas of their lives, they're probably not having enough orgasms in their life. Erica: Yeah. So just to connect this piece with what we talked about earlier, how is intuition and sexual energy connected? Jamila: Yeah. That goes back to that whole thing about sexual energy being creation, and when you are physically more in your body versus just kind of floating out in the breeze and ungrounding, sometimes sexual energy can make you more grounded, because it brings you back into your body. It makes you very aware of your body sensation. Sometimes people who are practicing mindfulness do exercises where they're focusing on their five senses. What do I see in this moment? What do I hear in this moment? What do I feel in this moment? What do I smell? And sexual energy heightens your physical senses. And so being in touch with yourself and being in your body can actually heighten your intuition, because it can bring a level of groundedness to you. And also again, like we talked about before, it can open up some flow, and intuitive energy is also about flow. Jamila: Intuitive intuition and intuitive energy is less about learning how to become intuitive and more about how to remove the blocks that we have put up that separate us from our own intuition. We are naturally intuitive by default. Children are born intuitive. We get socialized out of our intuition. We're either told that it's witchcraft or as children we're told, "It's not polite to say that." Jamila: So it's not uncommon for an intuitive child to walk into a room, be like, "I don't like that person. They hit people, or she's sleeping with him." And then what happens? The child is punished for saying the wrong thing, even though it was true. Instead of them being pulled aside and say, "Hey, your intuition is really on point. How did you know that?" And then letting the child explain how they felt that, and then having a conversation with the child about when it's appropriate to talk about things, instead of shutting that child down completely. So now the child not only has the message that is not appropriate to speak it's that I did something wrong by knowing this, and it shuts their intuition down. Kenrya: Mm. Jamila: And so when they're 30 and can't figure out how to navigate a transition in their life and can't get in touch with their intuition. Some of that can be traced back to them being shut down as a child, or being told that only God knows. That's not for you to know, or that what you're doing is witchcraft, or that you must be getting that information from negative or demonic spirits. When every culture, every religion across the globe has some form of seer, knower, prophet, clairvoyant, but it's not for everybody. So they're allowed to do it, but you're not allowed to do it. And so it can create a barrier. Jamila: And then having experiences over your lifetime, when you thought you were trusting your intuition, if something blew up in your face, and then you blame the intuition. Intuition isn't about making you joyful all the time. It's about getting you to the experiences that you need to have. And the blow up might have been a seminal moment in your life that changed your trajectory for your greater good, even though it was uncomfortable in that moment. But then they say, "Well, when I trusted my intuition, it didn't work." Or what you were trusting wasn't your intuition. It was your ego voice, or your fear voice masquerading as intuition. Jamila: And a lot of times people have difficulty differentiating between when I'm hearing the chatter in my head, what part is intuition, and what part is just my brain going all over the place? And one of the ways that you can navigate that is to get into your body, get out of your brain, because your brain is trying to convince you of all kinds of stuff, which may or may not be true. But your body never lies. Your body feeling light or feeling heavy, that's your intuition. When I think about going to this job, I feel heavy. Well, that's your intuition. When I think about this person or this situation, I feel light. I feel happy. I feel lit up. I feel physically lighter. That's your intuition saying, go in that direction. You know, again, you may not get a whole vision of things that are about to transpire, but you start paying attention to how your body responds to different people, different situations. Jamila: So if you're considering working with someone who's a psychic or a prophetess or a spiritualist, or a mystic, or whatever, because its different words in terms used for people who do this kind of work, first, if you're concerned about that, pray about it. Ask for guidance. Is it time for me to talk with someone like this, and is this person the right person for me? And is this the right time? Start with who you know and trust, and if that's God and Jesus or your deceased grandmother or your angels, talk with them first and ask if this is the right person. Don't do something that you're not really comfortable with, or work with someone you're not comfortable with. That's the first thing. Jamila: What I also want Black people to know is stop shaming people for tapping into their own guidance and working with Spirit in a way that may look different to you. It's okay to say I've never seen that before. I don't know what it is. I'm unfamiliar with it, but stop declaring everything as the devil's work that you don't understand. There's a lot of really beautiful things and beautiful people, helping people, who are being ostracized, judged, outcast because of their gifts, but their gifts were God given. And they're supposed to be out here helping people. Also, I wish that more Black people knew that you don't have to see a psychic to tune into your own intuition. You don't have to see a medium to communicate with your own ancestors and deceased loved ones and angels. That your intention to do so is 90% of the work. Jamila: I intend, I wish, I desire to have a deeper connection with my ancestors, with my angels. Start there. They will find you. You also can set some boundaries about how that is. You are not at their beck and call. I had to learn to set boundaries with people's ancestors that my office hours are from nine to five. That means don't be waking me up telling me about Shaniqua's boyfriend. I don't care at three o'clock in the morning. I'm trying to sleep. You might not have a body, but I do. And I need my rest. Now initially I didn't know I could do that. I was scared of them. Not scared of them, but scared that they had authority over me. I didn't understand, at that point, that we were in partnership, and that we each brought something to the table. And as such, I could set boundaries about how I worked. Jamila: Even if you're not a professional psychic, if you have a presence in your home, it's probably a guardian spirit watching over your home, your house, your land, your family, your property, but it's uncomfortable. Tell them, I'm glad you're here to protect me, but I don't want to know about it. I don't want to see you. You don't want to hear you. I don't want you moving my stuff around on the dresser. It makes me uncomfortable, and I appreciate you, but this is my boundary. Kenrya: Mm. Right. Word. Jamila: You can create boundaries. These are relationships just like anything and everything else. It's a relationship. And a relationship involves give and take and some balance. That's what I wish people knew. I also wish that people knew and Black people knew is that we are spiritual people, regardless of whether you have one particular faith or the other, we are a spiritual people. And our source of energy is Spirit. Don't get it twisted and get confused about what your Source is. You might have a job, but that's not your Source. You might have a lover, but that's not your Source, either. Get real clear about what your Source is and understand that God or Source or Spirit or the Universe, whatever words you want to use, is working through different people, different situations and different vehicles to bring you what is needed. Jamila: That also means that if that's not your Source, you can release it. Or if it leaves you, you're still good, because that was never your Source. And when you understand, that's not your Source, it takes some of the fear away of its leaving you, be it, the job, the person, the possessions, the status, the whatever, it takes some of that away. Kenrya: Right. Jamila: And it allows you to walk more empowered through this world. Kenrya: What's your superpower? Jamila: I mean intuition for number one. My superpower. Yeah. Aside from intuition, which is like the obvious thing, or maybe that is the superpower. That's a good question. What is my superpower? Okay. My superpower is intuition, but that word is kind of vague, but my superpower is the ability to see truth. Kenrya: Mm. Jamila: And it isn't just truth about facts, but it's the truth of who someone is, and what they are capable of, and what they were put on this earth to do. When I sit down with a client or sometimes it's not even a client, because it can happen spontaneously. When I can see who they were made to be and share that with them, it is such a powerful moment for them, but also for me. Sometimes I'll be in a reading with a client and sometimes my client laughs, because I'll be just as surprised as they are by the stuff that is revealed, and just as impressed as they are by who they were revealed when the revelation comes of who they were made to be, or what they were put on this earth to do, or what they're going to accomplish in their lifetime. When that comes through, I be like, "Woo." I'm just as impressed, just as wowed, just as floored, just as moved. My client may be in there crying, sometimes I'll be in there crying with them. Jamila: I mean, people are surprised by the fact also that these sessions are not like these holier than thou moments. They're real. And I'm me and you're going to get me, because I'm the interpreter of these messages, and they are funny, and they are real, and there's going to be cussing. Jamila: And the ancestors will be talking about sex a lot. People are surprised. I'm still surprised by how often that comes up, that the ancestors want us having good, healthy, loving, fun sex. It's amazing when people come, and they describe what they want in a soulmate, and they don't ever mention sex. And the ancestors be like, but let me tell you who's coming, and what they're bringing, and what their special superpower is when it comes to bedroom activities. And then they'll be like, "Oh my God, how do they know that's what I want." They know. How do you think they got to be your ancestors if they didn't procreate. They know something. They also understand the dynamics of joy and of ecstasy, and they want more of us to experience that. Whether it's through sexual energy or not, but they want us to experience the full vitality of life, which includes sexual energy, and however that is expressed. Kenrya: Right. What are you reading right now? Jamila: Ooh, I've got a stack of books. I just finally finished “The Water Dancer” by Ta-Nehesi Coates, fiction. I'm reading a bunch of nonfiction books on business, including Rachel Rogers, “We Should All Be Millionaires.” She's a Black woman talking about women entrepreneurs, and scaling up your business. Let's see, what else am I reading? I'm reading a bunch of articles and online classes and stuff right now. And I'm writing off and on, my own book. Kenrya: Yay. Jamila: Is coming one day. So it's coming in fits and spurts, both my story and lessons and intuition. My story has so many layers that when this book comes out, and there's some, oh my God moments about how my intuition really came to the forefront. You asked me what I was reading. It's time for me to reread one of my all-time favorites, which I reread periodically, because it changed my life is “Jambalaya” by Louisa Teish. It like three books in one. It's one part autobiography, one part history of spiritual New Orleans, including Marie Laveau, and one part instruction on rituals and charms and calling forth your own superpowers and spiritual care. Erica: I actually have it. Oh. So let me know when you start so we can read along together. Jamila: Yes. It's one of my all-time, all-time favorites and it's time for me to reread it. Kenrya: I want to read it with y'all. Erica: No, it's in and out, down. I'm looking. Jamila: Oh, is our group thread coming back? Remember when we had the “Game of Thrones” group threads. Kenrya: Yeah. So now we can just move on over to this. Jamila: And now we can do it on books. Yes. Erica: I don't see where it is, but I definitely have it. Jamila: It's a purple book. Erica: Yeah. And I remember... What you say? Kenrya: She says it's purple. Jamila: It's a purple book. Erica: So you see stuff. Oh color. I see it there. Yep. I see it. I see it right there. And the first couple of pages, I was like, "Oh, this book is amazing." Just first couple of pages. Kenrya: Wow. Erica: It grabs you. And I've just been a mess. But let me know when you start reading it and I will- Jamila: I will. I had a chance to meet her, Louisa Teish, in New Orleans. She doesn't live there anymore. She lives in the San Francisco Bay area, I think in Oakland. But she comes back to her hometown periodically. And when I lived in New Orleans, she came and did a book signing for her other books at a local Black bookstore. And I got a chance to meet her, and I totally geeked out, but she was just amazing and warm, and she showed us how to make a good drink. Erica: Good. Jamila: She's a treasure. She's a treasure. Erica: Okay. Well what's turning you on today? Jamila: What turns me on? Life turns me on. The fullness of it being in Barbados is such a life-changing experience for me, to live in this level of joy and abundance, because there is so much beauty here. It's physical eye therapy to just look around and look at all of these flowers and the lushness and the richness and the green. And then the ocean that I get to drive by every day or get in whenever I feel like it, just to have that level of abundance around, I am lit up by relationships. I just spent two weeks with my mom. She came here to visit in Barbados, and we had such an amazing time. And I'm so excited that I'm going home for Christmas, for the holiday season and spend time with my family. Jamila: I spent last Christmas in Barbados, which was lovely, but very, very weird, because it was 85, 90 degrees and it just wasn't the same. Erica: Yeah. Jamila: And I said, "Okay." So I've learned that I need to go home for Christmas. What am I lit up by? What turns me on? I am turned on by smart people. I am turned on by people who are living out their dreams, and living in full alignment with who they are. There's a certain energy to that. Even if they don't have all things figured out, you know when somebody is walking in their purpose, because they just give off a certain vibe. And I find that that is a turn on for me, for it lights up my energy. I am turned on by foot rubs. Erica: Yes. Jamila: A good foot massage. Kenrya: They make me giggle or kick. No, I love good massage. Jamila: You don't? No, great foot massage? Erica: Yeah. Legitimately, if I could find a submissive just for foot massages, I totally will. So if someone's out there- Jamila: You know somebody. There's something for everyone. Erica: Out there, holler at a player. Okay. So- Jamila: You just going to manifest that. Erica: It's happening. Okay. So Jamila- Jamila: It's happened. It's already done. Erica: We would like to ask- Jamila: Yes. Erica: Goofy questions. So here's yours. Well, it's not a question. It's a request. Give us a 30- to 60-second Ted Talk about something super ordinary. Jamila: A 30- to 60-second Ted Talk about something super ordinary? Erica: I'm going to set a timer too. Jamila: Okay. Can I have 30 seconds to think about what it is going to be before I start talking? Erica: Yes. Kenrya: You can have 15. Jamila: Okay. Okay. Something super ordinary. What's considered ordinary? Erica: Folding clothes. Picking out a good pair of shoes. Kenrya: Flowers. Jamila: Oh, okay. Erica: Doing a great ponytail. Jamila: Okay. Okay. Erica: Ready? Jamila: Okay. Erica: All right. Here we go. Sixty seconds on the clock. Go. Jamila: I mean, for real, for real, the best way to clean the grout in your bathroom tile is with a toothbrush and a paste that's made with Clorox bleach and baking soda. And then you just get it in there with your toothbrush in all of the crevices and the caulk. If you have dark spots around the caulk of your bathtub, put that paste on there, cover it with some plastic wrap. If it's really deep stains, let that sit for a while, a couple of hours if the stains are bad. And then you get in there with an old toothbrush and you scrub it, scrub it, scrub it, scrub it, and it will look like new. You'll be amazed at the grout and the caulk and the tile in your bathroom. It's going to look like totally brand new. It'll be sparkling. Erica: Yes. Kenrya: Yes. With 11 seconds to spare. I love it. Erica: You know anything about cleaning gets me excited. So I'm here for it. Yes. Jamila: What's funny is I'm not even a cleaner like that, but there are certain things I'm particular about. Kenrya: And grout is one of them? Jamila: In real time. I haven't had to do that, because being in Barbados, I have a housekeeper, and that is one of the best life decisions I have ever made. She comes every week, and it frees me up to not even think about cleaning my house. Not just that, but I stay clean, because I know she's coming on Friday. So I get organized so that she can clean. So my house stays more organized, but it frees up my energy to do other things. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Yeah. Jamila: And it's one of the best, and it's very affordable here. Like services here are really affordable for hair, beauty, cleaning, landscaping, all that stuff is super cheep. Kenrya: Right. That's awesome. Jamila: I don't do my own hair anymore. I was telling Kenrya, I get my lashes done. I didn't used to get my lashes done. Kenrya: You said something, $25? Jamila: $25 refills. Erica: Damn, I want my lashes done. Kenrya: Yeah. Jamila: It was probably $50 to $75 for the first set. And then $25 refill. Kenrya: Girl. Yeah. Erica: Mm. Yeah. Jamila: Yeah. Erica: You have figured it out. Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). That's pretty dope. And also, you are trying to help our listeners figure some stuff out. You're going to be offering a discount. All y'all got to do. Jamila: Absolutely. Kenrya: If y'all go to Inspired Jamila, that's I-N-S-P-I-R-E-D-J-A-M-I-L-A.com and enter the code, THETURNON, all smushed together, you'll get 10% off of a private, intuitive consultation either by phone or video. Jamila: Let me help you get unstuck. Get you clear about your purpose. Get you clear about the gifts that you were born with, that you may have had over multiple lifetimes, and how to unblock these obstacles that are preventing you from living your best life. You can have joy, peace, abundance, and all of that. That is your birthright. And sometimes you need a little bit of insight to help you have that breakthrough. Kenrya: Yeah. Jamila: So come holler at your girl, 10% off. And also next spring, spring 2022, I am hosting a retreat in Barbados. Kenrya: Are you? Jamila: And if you want to learn more about that, come to my website and holler at me, and I'll send the information. Kenrya: Okay. Okay. That's InspiredJamila.com. If you want to follow her on IG, you can go to Inspire dot Jamila. On Facebook, you are Inspire Jamila, right? All that's right? Jamila: That's right. Yes. Kenrya: Awesome. Yo, thank you for coming on. Erica: Thank you. Jamila: Thank you so much for having me. We've been waiting to do this for so long. It was all that we had anticipated. I love you two so much. Erica: We love you so much. Jamila: So grateful. Erica: Just to say, for real y'all, her helping you get through some stuck points in life, like whew, between Jamila and therapy, honey, you've helped make me who I am today. And it was simply by helping me see things that, like you said, just kind of help that energy flow. I remember our first session, I was super afraid, because I'm like, "She's going to tell me something scary," and it was beautiful. Jamila: That's what a lot of people say. Erica: It was beautiful. Kenrya: Oh, yeah. You were worried about that. Erica: Yeah. I was like, "She's going to tell me something that's scary." Jamila: That's common. People are afraid of that. Kenrya: See, I wasn't because we were already close. So I remember just being like, "She won't tell me if it's something bad, because we're friends." Right? Jamila: You're right. Kenrya: Then you told me to stay away from a nigga, and I didn't listen. Erica: Also, it was very much up to you to do. That's right. But no, the work you do, particularly the work you've done in my life, has been life changing. So, for real y'all, thank you. Jamila: Thank you, that means a lot to me. Kenrya: She's just a really fancy, fantastic friend. Erica: I'm thinking, oh God, I can. Yeah. Like. Jamila: You guys love on me. Erica: I can tell stories about how Jamila has come in and just showing up at the house, "Look, I'm helping you. Here we go." So yeah. Kenrya: It's true. I still have some of your Tupperware that- Erica: I do, but also, and then you left, I still need that, that dressing recipe. It was, oh,- Jamila: The avocado lime cilantro dressing. I'll hit you up with that. And that Tupperware, that was that disposable stuff that I bought just to take over to that, to your house. So just keep it. Okay. Kenrya: It's literally in the bin by the door. Jamila: It wasn't that good quality Tupperware that I need to repossess. Kenrya: I like to give people back their stuff, and it's been there. Jamila: I understand. I understand. But where am I going to put it? In my suitcase and bring it back to Barbados? Me going to Barbados means you can keep the Tupperware. Consider it a gift. And that avocado lime cilantro dressing, I'm actually making that tonight. It is so yummy. Kenrya: She used to make it and drop it off in mason jars. Jamila: Oh yeah. I remember. Erica: No, we was putting that shit on everything down here. Do we need to make that recipe available to the listeners? Kenrya: Yeah, we can put it on the show notes. Jamila: Because you know, people are going to be mad. They're going to be like, "I can't taste it. Why they talk about that? I can't taste it." Kenrya: Yes. Okay. Jamila: That salad dressing is light, it really is. Yeah. Okay. That was the first homemade salad dressing that I ever made, and it changed the game for me. It is so good. Yeah. Kenrya: So we'll share it once you share with us. Thanks. So that is it for this week's episode of The Turn On. Thank y'all for listening. We'll see y'all next week. Bye. Erica: Bye. Jamila: Bye. [theme music] Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Hit subscribe right now in your favorite podcast app and at YouTube.com/TheTurnOnPodcast, so you'll never miss an episode. Erica: Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. And you can find links to books, transcripts, guest info, what's turning us on, and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Kenrya: And don't forget to email us at [email protected] with your book recommendations and your pressing sex-and related questions. Erica: And you can support the show by leaving us a five-star review, buying some merch or becoming a patron of the show. Just head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to make that happen. Kenrya: Thanks for listening and we'll see you soon. Holla. |
The Turn On
The Turn On is a podcast for Black people who want to get off. To open their minds. To learn. To be part of a community. To show that we love and fuck too, and it doesn't have to be political or scandalous or dirty. Unless we want it to be. Archives
September 2022
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