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Amazon Music | Apple Podcasts | Google Play | iHeart Radio | Pandora | Radio Public | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn | YouTube CONNECT WITH THE TURN ON Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | Goodreads | Patreon SHOW NOTES In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya read "The Romantic Agenda" by Claire Kann and talk asexuality, aromanticism, heteronormative conditioning, love bombing, and balancing platonic and romantic relationships. RESOURCES
ADVERTISEMENT Buzzsprout The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information. TRANSCRIPT Kenrya: Come here. Get off. [theme music] Erica: Hey. Kenrya is smiling. Hey y'all. Welcome to- Kenrya: I am. I muted myself. Erica: Huh? Kenrya: Yeah, I had muted myself. I was like, "Oh, you want me to say hey [crosstalk 00:00:30]," right? Erica: So hey, welcome to the penultimate episode of season five of The Turn On. Your lovely co-hosts, Erica and Kenrya are here, and cohost Kenrya, is about to read an excerpt from “The Main Agenda.” Kenrya: “The Romantic Agenda.” Erica: Fuck. “The Romantic Agenda.” Kenrya: I like how you were sliding into that though. That was nice. Erica: I thought you were going to join me in chorus. Kenrya: Oh. Erica: Okay, “The Romantic Agenda” written by Claire Kann in 2021. Sit back, relax, get your wine, weed, whatever you need, and enjoy. Kenrya: “The Romantic Agenda,” by Claire Kann. Kenrya: Being asexual wasn't a choice for Joy. Deciding to have sex would be. There are too many things to consider, so many potential outcomes like pregnancy and STIs that could change your life forever. She doesn't see it as fun like Malcolm, and she doesn't feel the desire to have sex with another person. The cons simply outweigh the pros. If she ever decides to have sex, she wants it to be an informed and active choice, and she wants to feel safe. Kenrya: Joy continues, "I need someone who will be okay with me laughing, asking too many questions, being weird and cracking jokes, someone that can calmly explain things to me in the moment without getting frustrated or overwhelmed. One of my worst nightmares is having sex with someone, and then they get mad at me because they think I'm not taking it seriously, or because I don't automatically turn into a puddle of moaning mush, when if they knew me at all, they would know that I am taking it seriously. It's a big deal to me. I just express it differently because I want to understand what's happening while it's happening." Kenrya: "I can do that," Fox says too quickly. "You can trust me." Joy manages not to laugh. "Let's think with our big brains, not our little brains." She places her hands on his neck, stroking his jaw with her thumbs. "You're a great person, Fox. I really do like you, but I also met you three days ago. I don't know you well enough to trust you like that. I'm not having sex with you tonight." "Hm, that's exactly what I wanted to hear," she whispers, mouth near his. "I can see you thinking." "I am." He gives her a quick peck and rests his forehead against her chest. "Big brain needs a minute to catch up." Kenrya: Joy holds him there, rubbing his back. "Cool. I'll wait here." He laughs and mutters, "God." His expression is solemn when he says, "I really like you too, Joy." "Okay," she inhales, holding it to prepare herself to be disappointed. It always ends like this. "I'm very attracted to you." He lifts his head. "I know." Her gaze flicks downward and up again. "I can tell." That made him smile. "I hear you. I understand what you're saying." "But?" "No buts," he says, "I understand." "No buts? No questions? Nothing?" "Nah, I said I understand. Is there something else you need to tell me?" "No, that's it." Fox kisses her again, softly at first, and then harder and with more urgency. Kenrya: She's not overwhelmed, but she gets close when he squeezes her thighs. Her hands are on his wrists in record time, holding him firmly. He breaks their kiss and looks her in the eyes, still soft, still understanding. He asked, "Can I touch you?" Touching makes it intentional. Kissing, combined with touching, creates a shift from kissing to arousal, to sex. Joy only wanted the first part, maybe not forever, but certainly for right now. "Depends where." He thinks about it, and answers, voice low and earnest, "Is everywhere too much?" Joy laughs, wrapping her arms around his neck, and repeatedly kissing his cheeks. "It might be, so let's start slow." Kenrya: "What are you doing?" She pauses, holding the hem of her sweatshirt. "I'm taking off my clothes. I'm okay with some touching. Unless you want me to keep them on." "Hm," Fox squeezes his eyes shut for a second, shaking his head, "Can I just..." he touches her at the waist, "Maybe I should do that." "Oh," she says, understanding him. "Panties stay on unless I say otherwise." "I understand. Lift your arms." His voice is firm, a rumbling command. She does, and he slides her sweatshirt off with one hand, and unclasps her bra with the other. "That's... skillful." Fox kisses up her neck and ends with nibbling her earlobe as his fingers trace the outline of her shoulder blades. Kenrya: Joy places her hands on his shoulders, trying to concentrate on how each sensation feels, so she can remember what she likes, but it blurs together. Everything is sending signals to her brain at once. He stops, moving to kiss her chin. "You don't like being on your back." Joy bites her lip in surprise. When did he figure that out? He said it like he already knew the answer, so she just nods to confirm. "If I'm next to you, would that work? Not on top or over, just right next to you, like we're side by side." "I never tried that." "Do you want to? You can say a flower if you want to stop." Joy kisses his forehead. "Let's try it." Kenrya: She lies back in the bed, head propped up by pillows. True to his word, he stays next to her, completely to one side as he kisses her. He creates a path, touching, and kissing, and tasting down her body. Her neck, her shoulders, each of her arms, and all her fingers. Her chest, down, down, down, down, down. When she laughs because it tickles, he does too. When he takes off her shorts, lifting her legs in the air and kissing down the length of them, she holds his gaze. On the way back up, he paid special attention to all the spots he missed on the way down, like the backs of her knees, her elbows, and her waist. Kenrya: Joy shivers, and gasps, back arching. There's a slight tremble low in her abdomen, the same kind she gets when she masturbates. "You okay?" "Kiss me again, right there." He does, and the same thing happens. She laughs this time, absolutely delighted by the sensation. "Ah," he says, "I think you have a spot." "What's that?" She giggles, and feels stupid for doing it, but can't stop. "Think of it like a cheat code," he says, laughing too. Fox lifts himself up, and she holds her arms open for him, bringing him close. He kisses her mouth and says, "You're too beautiful. I almost can't believe you're real." "Fox, no. Don't say that." She buries her face in his neck, practically her new favorite spot. "It's so cheesy, and I love it." [theme music] Erica: Hey, we're back. Kenrya: Hey. Erica: Okay y'all, so thank you for that lovely rendition, Kenrya, that lovely rendition of a scene from this book. Okay, you have to give the synopsis. Kenrya: Okay. This book stars Joy, who- Erica: Joy... and pain. Sunshine and rain. Sorry. Kenrya: Yes, Joy. Huh, that made me think of some stuff. So, Joy is in love with her best friend, Malcolm, which we find out right in the beginning, and they work together, which makes it interesting. As the book opens, Malcolm tells Joy that he needs her to go with him on a trip that weekend, and because she's got these feelings for him, she thinks that the trip is where he's finally going to tell her that he loves her, and they whatever. Kenrya: None of this is a spoiler, because you find out right away. Oh, that's pretty. You find out right away that he actually has planned this weekend to introduce her to his about-to-be girlfriend, Summer. She absolutely feels ambushed. She's like, "You ain't never mentioned this bitch before, and now all of a sudden we're supposed to be going away on a weekend?" So she decides to go, and then she finds out that Summer has brought her best friend, Fox. Erica: Wait, wait, wait, they knew from the beginning that Summer was bringing her friend, because that's why he invited her. Kenrya: Oh yes, but she didn't know who it was, or anything like that. Erica: Yeah, he was just like, "She's bringing her friend. I'm bringing you." Kenrya: "Can you run interference?" Kind of a deal. Erica: Yeah, exactly. Kenrya: Yeah, so not only is she not going away on this romantic whatever with her best friend who she loves, but she's also expected to entertain this nigga she ain't never met before in order to help them be able to have time? The fuck? That's how Joy feels about this whole scenario. But she says yes, and the four of them go away and hijinks ensue. Erica: Dot, dot, dot. Okay, so I was struggling with how to talk about this, how to structure this, because there are a few themes that I want to discuss, but then I also want to discuss sexuality. What you want to do, themes or sexuality? Kenrya: Let's start with the sex. Erica: Here's the thing. It's clear in this book, they say it multiple times, she talks about it a lot, Joy is asexual, as is Malcolm. But it presents itself in different ways, because like everything, like sexuality, asexuality is on a spectrum. Kenrya: Yeah, folks are not monoliths. Erica: Yes, so to prepare for this, I wanted to look for some good definitions and ways to wrap our head around asexuality. I'll be very honest... First, asexuality is just you have no sexual attraction, like you don't want to have sex. Well no, I'm sorry, see, already fucked it up. It's a lack of sexual attraction. That's it. That is it. I think it is difficult for us to think about that because we have been programmed, conditionalized, institutionalized to believe one, sexual attraction and romantic attraction go together, and also to believe that both sexual attraction and romantic attraction is what we want, the highest thing- Kenrya: The end-all-be-all. Erica: Exactly. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Even from kids, we were programmed that not only liking someone... Liking someone also is coupled with wanting to have sex with them. Okay, maybe not, but like- Kenrya: Which is gross. Mm-hmm (affirmative). Yeah. Erica: That's what it is, you like somebody, you do it. That is why I think it is so difficult for everyone- Kenrya: Allosexuals to wrap their heads around asexuality. Erica: Exactly, because it's like, hand in hand and that kind of thing. Also, I learned that there are asexual people and there are aromantic people. You know who actually does a really good job of explaining this shit, and I was mad that I fell down a rabbit hole? Kenrya: Hm? Erica: Tinder. Kenrya: Really? Erica: They have a whole YouTube channel and they talk about demisexual, asexual, sapiosexual. They talk about all of that, and then they have actual people that are, that identify as that, to talk about their experiences. This is where a lot of the information I got came from, because it was multiple people talking about their experiences and there were people of color in there talking about their experiences. Kenrya: Nice. Erica: So, I like to ask the people without making them... If you're in a space where you're like, "I'm going to teach," great. But I ain't trying to just- Kenrya: Put your ass under a microscope, yeah. Erica: Exactly. So, there is asexual and aromantic. Some people are asexual and aromantic. That is like, "I ain't trying to be romantic. I ain't trying to be sexual." In the clip there was this woman, and she was asexual and aromantic. She was like, "I am not going to marry. I am not going to date. I have no desire for that. It kind of looks weird to me.” Erica: But there are also people that are asexual, and I forgot the term, but they do have romantic attraction. That presents itself in, "I have a boyfriend. I want a boyfriend. I want a girlfriend. I want a partner. And we may get married. It's just I don't really have a desire to have sex with you." But also, having a desire to have sex is still very different from actually enjoying fucking, which is what Malcolm is. Erica: Malcolm is asexual, but he also enjoys the act of having sex, because- Kenrya: It's the closeness, the- Erica: It's a dick. Yes, but to me, it's- Kenrya: Nerve endings? Erica: Exactly. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: It just is. I think we have to... In my mind, I slide it in... I know you're playing Wordle, right? Kenrya: Oh, of course I'm playing Wordle. Erica: I don't even fucking understand it, so this is probably a really bad explanation, but you know how on Wordle they have the two squares, there's a square and a square, and a square and a square, and a square and a square, is that Wordle, right? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative), yeah. Erica: If you think of two squares as a person, top square is sexual, bottom square is romantic, you might be asexual and aromantic. You might be sexual and aromantic. It's possible for one light to be on- Kenrya: To be one and not the other. Erica: ... and not the other. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: People can live that way and have joy-filled lives. It's difficult for some asexual people to even recognize that they are asexual, and then identify as such because they're like, they can see people and see that people are attractive, they're like, "Oh my God, that person is fucking gorgeous." I saw a TikTok. It was this chick, she was like, "I'm asexual. Wow, that chick is hot." And then she turns around and she's like, "Wow, that chick is hot. Am I sexual?" Then she looks at a bookshelf, "Wow, that bookshelf is hot." Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: No, I'm not. So, that kind of thing. Also, if you're interested in this, #asexual. Do not do #ace on TikTok because motherfuckers just abuse everything. Kenrya: Oh, wow. Erica: [inaudible 00:18:14]. You'll find yourself- Kenrya: It's just people use it for a lot of other shit. Erica: [crosstalk 00:18:18], but #asexual on TikTok, man you're going to find... I love TikTok because people, they not only teach, but they teach with levity. Then other folks be like, "Man, I identify," and that kind of thing. Kenrya: That's what's up. Erica: Yeah, TikTok will teach you a lot. I'll be honest- Kenrya: Can I give another resource? Erica: TikTok, no. TikTok- Kenrya: No, I'm saying, can I give another resource? Erica: Oh, no. No, yeah. Kenrya: Why? Erica: I'm just playing with you. Give another resource. Kenrya: I just started, and I'm not very far into, but already really dig it, “ACE: What Asexuality Reveals About Desire, Society, and the Meaning of Sex” by Angela Chen, which has given me some definitions and somewhat- Erica: No, I'm like ain't nobody going to read that. Well, your people will. Niggas that listen for Erica go to TikTok or YouTube. Kenrya: It's a book show, bitch. Erica: I know. Kenrya: [crosstalk 00:19:20]. Erica: And I have tons of books. Kenrya: But you can do both, right? Erica: You can do both. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Just get the book, and use it as reference. Kenrya: We'll link to it. Erica: Or listen to it. As a sex educator, I know this is... I was going to say it’s kind of fucked up, but no, this is who the fuck I am. When it comes to sexuality, I recognize that that shit is a fucking spectrum. Not only is a spectrum that goes this way, horizontally, it's a spectrum that's up and down, inside, outside. It is a fucking sphere. Kenrya: Sphere, yeah. Erica: Sphere. There are so many parts of it that makes one person who they are. Again, it's been difficult for me to even wrap my head around these things, because I have been conditioned that one and the other goes in hand, and you can't uncouple them. But I feel like this book has done a really good job of showing that one, asexual people are just fucking people with issues and da-da-da-da, but also- Kenrya: Just like the rest of us, yeah. Erica: It presents itself in so many different ways that even if someone says they're asexual, that could mean a million different things. Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative), yeah. That's what's up. Erica: You got anything? Kenrya: Just that, so Claire... This is Claire's fourth book, and I have read them all. I am a huge fan. The first one that I read from her is called “Let's Talk About Love,” and it stars an asexual character. Claire does a really good job in that book of explaining what you were just explaining with the TikTok where the woman was like, "That woman's hot. Oh, that bookcase is hot." Her character in that book has a color-coded system, and they check in with their friends like, "Is that hot? Is this what y'all think is sexy?" Kenrya: She calls it her "squee score," like does it make her squee, does it give her joy and delight to look at something, or whatever. As another resource for understanding, I thought “Let's Talk About Love” was a really great place to start in the fictional realm to kind of get into the head of a character who identifies- Erica: And it's a YA novel, right? Kenrya: It's a YA, yeah. Mm-hmm (affirmative). Erica: Which is also really great- Kenrya: It's excellent. Erica: ... because it helps young people understand, and understand the differences in people. I'm not even sure if I finished that thought, going back to younger people identifying as asexual, because we are conditioned that love, attraction, sex looks a certain way, a lot of young people find themselves confused about whether or not they're asexual because they're like, "Well, I like this. I don't like that." Again, it's a sphere. Kenrya: Yeah, even in the book, Joy realizes that she identifies that way because there's a fair and Malcolm is there at a booth by himself, with a handout that's like "Are you asexual?" She's like, "Oh, shit." Erica: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Kenrya: "Maybe I am." Erica: Actually, there was this chick I found on YouTube, a white chick, and she is asexual and aromantic, and married, and happy. So, I didn't go down... She's got a whole ass channel about her and her partner, da-da-da-da-da. Kenrya: That's the thing. We always talk about how you build the life that you want. You don't have to have a romantic partner to have a partner. You could just have someone who you care about be your person that you live with and grow with. That's what it sounds like is her situation. Erica: Not to sound too hotep-y, but I do think that society favors people that are monogamous and married. Kenrya: Yeah, I don't think that's hotep-y. I think it's [crosstalk 00:24:01]- Erica: The man wants us to procreate. Kenrya: You didn't say that that's how it should be. You just said that that's how it is, and I think unfortunately it's true. Erica: So, people try to fit themselves in boxes that aren't necessarily for them in order to gain those privileges. This also applies to just nonmonogamy. Just everything, I think we are conditioned from the very beginning that we are supposed to be sex, love, romance are all packed into one. When you pull those apart, you're the devil. It's a million things, and that's not it. It is very possible to want to fuck somebody and not fucking like them, not want to spend the rest of your life with them, and not even fucking be attracted to them. Erica: It's also possible to be attracted to someone and not want to fuck them. There are so many things, so many parts and bits of it that do not fit into that first comes love, marriage, baby carriage type shit. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Yeah, that's what I've got on that. You got anything else to add? Kenrya: Uh-uh (negative), no that's good. Erica: Okay, so we've got the sex out the way. Now, at the very beginning of the book, Joy notes that her friend Malcolm is a hopeless romantic and a serial monogamist, which made me think about love bombing. I'm not saying that he's a love bomber, but she did say- Kenrya: Yeah, because I don't think he is. Erica: ... but she did say he has been known to make these sweeping gestures. Kenrya: Like Toby on fucking “This Is Us,” which is why I don't like Toby, and I'm glad... Have you been watching “This Is Us”? Erica: Girl, I stopped a long time ago. Kenrya: Oh, you got to come back. Anyway, go ahead. That's why I don't like Toby. Erica: Yeah, and- Kenrya: It's all love bombing. Erica: Okay, so love bombing is essentially... You describe it, because it's my definition that always fucks... We literally have 20 minutes of me- Kenrya: That's not true. Erica: ... doing one definition. Kenrya: I don't know. Do I have a compact definition of love bombing? I guess when I think of it, I think of it as where people basically use the trappings of expressing their love as manipulation. We talk about how love is an action and a verb, and blah-blah-blah, well these are people who kind of weaponize that. They use it to make you think that they are the only person in the world who can love you in this way, and oftentimes it goes hand in hand with isolating you from the other people who you love. But not always. Kenrya: Yeah, it's a form of manipulation, and a form of "I love you so much, girl, can't you see?" Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: I'm sure there's a much better definition. Erica: No, I think that's good. It's just, you know, niggas showing up at your job with a fucking- Kenrya: Yeah, that grand gesture shit that's not earned, and out-sized for the relationship. Erica: If you need a compact definition, that is it, grand gestures that are not earned and are out-sized of where we are. Like, "Nigga, you are expressing love on a 10, and we are only at two." You know what it made me think of? Kenrya: What? Erica: Nard dog. Andy Bernard from “The Office.” Kenrya: Lord, have mercy. That whole character is a fucking mess. Erica: He's a fucking mess, but is love bombing, right? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Erica: Now, with the exception of Erin, because I do think that with Erin, his love bombing was definitely a weapon, but with Angela, that motherfucker just didn't know. You know, who did he do the 12 Days of Christmas with? Was it Erin or Angela? Where she came out and there was 12 drummers drumming, six lords leaping. Whatever, I don't know. Kenrya: I want to say that was Angela, but I don't know, and I'm sure- Erica: No, you know what, Angela liked “Little Drummer Boy,” and so they said they were going to walk down the aisle to that. Kenrya: To “Little Drummer Boy.” But see, in his case with her, I always felt like it was over-compensation because he knew that she wasn't fully present for him. Erica: Yes. Yeah. Kenrya: Which is still love bombing. Erica: Yeah, and I saw the episode the other day where he proposed to her. In “The Office” carnival, there're fireworks in the loopty-loo, the Ferris wheel. Then he's like, "Angela, can I have your tiny little hand in marriage?" "Okay." Kenrya: She was never there for him. Erica: But yeah, that's what love bombing looks like, like this motherfucker is going all out and you're like... And, what I feel like what happens a lot, for at least Black women, and I'm about to make a sweeping statement, Kenrya, cuss me out, but I feel like for Black women a lot of times we're not used to being loved out loud. Kenrya: When it happens [crosstalk 00:30:02]- Erica: When it happens, it's just like [crosstalk 00:30:04]- Kenrya: It feels really good. Erica: ... you get caught up in it, caught up in the rapture of love bombing. Kenrya: I would agree with you. I don't know that this is exclusive to Black women, but you're for damn sure right that we are often not loved out loud, yeah. So, when we do, and we've been taught that we don't really deserve that, that we don't warrant that, we don't get those big things in media, which is why romance is so great because we get those happily ever afters where we don't get them in other places in media, when Black folks write us. It feels good. Kenrya: We had a book this season where that was an issue, where dude kept making these big ole' things and showing up, and we were like- Erica: This is a problem. Kenrya: This feels like a precursor to abuse. Erica: Yeah, yeah. Yep, and I think about... Was that this season? Kenrya: What, that book? Erica: It was this season. Okay, yeah, yeah. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: I think also social media has a lot... Because we see on social media a fucking rapper buying his girlfriend a room full of roses and a Bentley, we think that a nigga buying a room full of roses and a Bentley is extravagant, but it's love. Kenrya: Even though there was a news story two weeks ago that this nigga had another baby on her. Erica: Oh, shit. I don't know who we're talking about. Kenrya: Oh, I'm just saying in general. I'm thinking of one particular couple, where he's always buying her some shit, but it's always usually we just heard that he did some other shit, that he cheated with somebody else. Cardi. Erica: Oh, okay. Kenrya: It's always preceded by some fuck shit that he just did, and now he's making some big gesture, buying her this truck, or this car, or whatever the fuck. We got to look at this shit wholistically, fam. Erica: Yeah, and also these motherfuckers are like a car is a fucking day of [crosstalk 00:32:13]. I'm just saying, love bombing is a thing, and although it feels good, it's not always good. It's not good. Kenrya: And it usually only feels good in the short term. Erica: Yeah, because if you were- Kenrya: He's usually covering something up. Erica: If somebody's doing some shit, and you're like, "Oh my gosh, this is fucking amazing, but I don't even know this nigga's middle name..." oh my goodness, oh wait a minute. I'm watching “90 Day Fiancé.” I just started it. There's this guy on there. He was on last season. His name is Usman, also known as " Sojaboy," and he is a Nigerian superstar rapper-singer. Erica: Last season, he had this white woman. Of course, she had leather skin, hair, and a voice like this. Got married. Didn't go well. They divorced. So guess what, Usman is back with another white woman. Kenrya: Is Michael still with old girl? Erica: Who? Kenrya: Michael, ain't that the other Nigerian? Erica: Michael and Angela? Yes. They're still there. Poor Michael, they just ain't letting his ass in the States. They just can't let him in the States. Anyway- Kenrya: Really? Erica: Uh-uh (negative), I don't think he got in the States. Kenrya: Oh, shit. Erica: I don't think [crosstalk 00:33:40]. This made me think. Usman, I feel so bad that we're on this tangent, but Usman told this chick... She was like, "I met him. We talk online. He's my boo. He told me I'm his potential girlfriend." So, she flies to fucking Zanzibar to meet him, as he's preparing for this video shoot. He's like, "We need separate rooms," and so she gets the fucking presidential suite, because she's like, "We're going to be together, and we need-" so she got the fucking presidential suite in this fucking resort in Zanzibar. Erica: Then, the first night they're together, he comes to her room because of course, they're not staying together because he's like, "Last white bitch was crazy. This white bitch maybe going to be crazy, and you need to earn your way into girlfriend-hood." This bitch bought this nigga a fucking MacBook Pro and a PS5. Kenrya: Oh, boy. Erica: He's hype. He starts kissing on it. Then he was like, "Okay, I'm going to go back to my room," and he takes his shit and goes back to his room. It was horrible. Love bombing. Kenrya: Then this is her trying to buy his affection, right? Like- Erica: He was like, "Aha. Aha. It's going to take more, but I appreciate that." If someone had just bought a new MacBook Pro, them hoes ain't cheap. I was just like, "Oh." Even if he got the basic model, that's about $2,500.00. Kenrya: [crosstalk 00:35:33]. Erica: So yeah, anyway. Whew, have fun. By the time this airs, we'll see if Usman and the girl, who also is a huge Michael Jackson fan, has a Michael Jackson tattoo on her... It was just so cringey. I'm watching it like, "Ew." Okay. Also, we learn that Malcolm had hopeless romantic serial monogamist. He had a girlfriend before, and they broke up because the girlfriend was like, "You got this homegirl, Joy. You're in love." Did she say that he was in love with her? Kenrya: She felt like he always chose Joy over her, that her concerns, her needs always came before hers, and she had a problem with that. Erica: Which, as a woman who has really strong female friendships, yeah nigga, to a point. I just feel like if you come in my life, you need to recognize that until you earn spot number one, nigga you at spot like number 25. Kenrya: Yeah, I think that's true. You're a stranger. I don't know, it sounded like in their situation, they had been together for a little while, but it felt like it was more that she felt threatened... She just felt threatened by their relationship in general, and she probably also had an inkling that Joy was in love with him too. I'm sure that didn't fucking help. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: Yeah, it's different when you know that there's nothing there but friendship. Then if you're insecure- Erica: Because yeah, I just can't imagine in bed with this nigga like, "Your best friend in love with you." "No, no she ain't. No, she ain't." That kind of shit, that shit... Don't gaslight me. Kenrya: Right. Erica: I cannot believe that niggas don't see when they have friends in love with them. Kenrya: I can. I think that sometimes niggas are oblivious, and I ain't going to front, I've been oblivious too. I have been in relationships where dudes have definitely been like, "Oh, he loves you," about a friend. I'll be like, "What the fuck are you talking about?" Erica: Yeah, but I told you. Kenrya: Yeah. Yeah, again, I don't think it's true. That's what I'm saying, if I can be oblivious, other people can be oblivious too, is my point. There's a difference between just genuinely not seeing it and not getting it, because there's no vibe, and knowing that is true, and acting like it's not. Do you know what I'm saying? Like gas lighting, like you were just saying. Erica: I am about to be embarrassingly honest and share something with my listeners. Kenrya: Okay. Erica: I had a friend, and they were... It started off we were dating, and then we stopped dating for whatever reasons. We just became really, really good friends, like the homie, one of my closest guy friends. But as I started moving on to dating, and he moved on to dating, I realized I can't do this shit because I still like this motherfucker. I recently had to cut the shit off. It sucks. It really sucks, because that was my homie. We genuinely had a friendship, but I also think if I was a chick with him I'd be like, "That hoe Erica ain't coming around. This bitch is crazy." Erica: Well also, I got probably fucked up. I got too much pride to be putting myself out there looking crazy, but if you were around us you knew that there was something. We had conversations, like "Would you be comfortable being around a friend," that kind of thing. He was like, "I want to be happy. I'd love to meet a guy," like it was serious. I'm like, "No, fuck that. I'm crazy. I'm going to burn this shit. I'm going to show her sex tapes of us." Erica: I know, it's wrong. Because I had to be honest with myself, like I like you, and although there are reasons that we're not together, I don't need to be front row of some bullshit that you guys... Not bullshit. But front row. Kenrya: You meant that. Erica: Of some bullshit you got going on. It fucking sucks. Particularly, as we've had all these snow days, and I've been just going through shit. I'm like, "Man, I want to call my friend." We were such good friends, that our friend group started getting kind of meshed, and so... Yeah. Kenrya: I'm sorry, I just realized who you were talking about. Erica: Exactly. Even when I told my friends, "Yo, we had to dead it," they were like, "Wait, we can't go hang out with him no more? You bitches." Because again, he was the homie, I was a homie, we had a great relationship, but it just couldn't go any further. Okay, I spilled my shit. Kenrya: I'm sorry. That sucks. Erica: What'd you say? Kenrya: I said, I'm sorry, that sucks. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: You know, I was never a fan of that whole situation, but- Erica: I know you weren't. Kenrya: I understand. Erica: I know you weren't, which is crazy. That was my [inaudible 00:42:10]. That was my- Kenrya: I know, but it always felt like it wasn't going to go where you might want it to go. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: I think I just wanted you to not get sucked into something that couldn't go the way you wanted it to go. Erica: Yeah. Yeah. What was interesting is, once we shed the whole, "Okay, we're not dating," I got to see his ain't shitness, and he got to see my ain't shitness, and we were both in the middle of doing ain't shit shit, and being like, "You know what, we can do this ain't shit shit together, and we'd be good. We'd be fun having doing this ain't shit shit together." Erica: Okay, so Malcolm bought Joy to run interference and be the wing man to Summer and Fox. I kept calling this man Wolf. Kenrya: Calling him Wolf. Erica: I kept calling this man Wolf. I knew it was a- Kenrya: It was a wild animal. Erica: It was a wild animal that my son would want on a T-shirt. I remember when Cracker Barrel, you know the white people shirts of the wolf howling at the moon with sparkles and shit? You know what I'm talking about, right? Kenrya: I do. I do. Erica: We're in Cracker Barrel, as my son calls "Crackerberry," and this man had on this shirt. He came up, and he was like, "Look at his shirt." I was like, "Bro." He was like, "That shirt is so cool. I want one like that for Christmas." I said, "Not on my watch," and insert Iyanla Vanzant GIF. Kenrya: GIF. Why you do him like that? Erica: He don't want it no more, so that's fine. Kenrya: That shirt was going to bring him some joy. Erica: And how he has... I bought him this jacket for Christmas. When I tell you he wore this motherfucker every single day, I was like, "Bro-" Kenrya: Well good. Erica: "You got to wash this shit before you wear it again." The only time he washed a load and got it done quickly, because I was like, "Bro, you can't wear this shit to school." He was like, "Okay, fine," and he washed that shit quick. Okay, anyway, so Malcolm brought Joy to run interference between Fox so he could love up on some Summer. It was actually interesting because Joy was initially like, "This some bullshit. I ain't going to be a part of it," but in her willingness to appease her best friend, which we don't have to go into that, her willingness to appease her best friend, she entertained Fox. Erica: And he wasn't a bad guy, right? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative), yeah. Erica: Have you ever been... Me and Kenrya met in college, right? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Erica: In my mind, if we were friends in junior high/high school, one, we would have had matching outfits, two, we would have been at the mall. Kenrya: Absolutely. Absolutely. Erica: Three, I would have been like, "Girl, you got to come, because my friend brought a friend." We would have totally been in the car like, "You got a friend for my girlfriend?" Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative), absolutely. That was- Erica: So, I started meeting niggas at the mall, or Northwest Plaza, like, "How you been?" Kenrya: I was like, that was my high school experience with my cousin. That was how we went out with dudes. First of all, we would get dropped off at the strip mall, and then meet dudes at the mall, and walk around outside because it was a strip mall. Or we'd go to the mall-mall, but you had to buy something because you ain't want to look lame without a bag. Erica: Oh, yeah. Kenrya: So, you would buy something cheap and then just- Erica: Claire's. Kenrya: ... you would just walk around. Erica: Claire's maybe. Kenrya: Go to Claire's, exactly. Get something cheap, and then walk around and collect numbers for your pager. Erica: Do you remember collecting numbers? Kenrya: Yes, ma'am. Erica: I remember, I think I mentioned this, Saint Louis, we had a skating rink called The Palace. I remember- Kenrya: Which was in a Children's Palace, which is so wild to me. Erica: Yes. I remember going to The Palace, and I would always go with my cousins, and we would be getting dressed in the mirror, practicing dances and shit, and we'd be ready to walk out and be like, "Oh, make sure you get a piece of paper and a pencil." Kenrya: That's right, something small enough to fit in your shit so you could get numbers. That's right. Erica: Oh my God. Kenrya: Yeah, so that was like we would go to Randall Park Mall, or we would go to Southgate, depending on what we were trying to get into and who were trying to meet. So, if my cousin was over, then I would have whatever dude I had bring somebody for her. So, she would always have a boyfriend that lived on my side of town, and I would have somebody on her side of town. That was when we hung out. We would have... Some of them, it's so funny, I can't remember names. Kenrya: Literally, I was talking to my partner the other day about... He was watching “First 48” or something, and it's in Cleveland, Ohio. Erica: I hate that I love “First 48” so much. Fuck 12. Fuck the police. Niggas With Attitude. Kenrya: But you like “First 48.” Erica: I love “First 48.” Kenrya: I only really watched it with him, but I used to watch it [crosstalk 00:47:38]- Erica: Because when the nigga's blurred out, he's not a suspect. He didn't do it. Kenrya: Yeah, yeah, so you kind of know what's going to happen. It was something where somebody was wearing boots. It was some shit. I was like, "Boo, what time of year was it?" It was some shit. I was telling him that there was some dude... Because I was like, we only wear Timbs when it's wintertime. I was like, "Wearing Timbs outside of the season is some New York shit." I was telling him that there was some dude that I went out with a few times from New York, who was in Cleveland, and he thought he was cool because he was from New York, but he was wearing his Timbs in the summer and we made fun of him. Kenrya: I don't remember his name- Erica: Ole' sweaty foot motherfuckers. Kenrya: Because we called him "Boots." Erica: You called him what? Kenrya: We called that nigga Boots. Erica: He was Boots before Dora had Boots. Kenrya: Nigga, all I remember is that we called him Boots, but he was one of the dudes who he had a cousin. He was in town visiting his cousin, so me and him went out, and we brought him and his cousin came, and my cousin came, and we hung out, and that was what we did. Erica: [crosstalk 00:48:39] from out of town. Kenrya: Because then you see him for a little while, and then he is gone. Erica: And you're like, "Hm." Kenrya: Which is why I can't remember Boots' real name. Erica: I'm exotic. I got a nigga from New York. Kenrya: Exactly. Lord. Erica: Such a summer love. Horrible. Kenrya: As a teenager, yes. As an adult, I am not the one that usually got pulled into those escapades because I used to be a serial monogamist, so I was never free to do be the friend who came out with the person with the friend. I'm thinking of our friends who are those friends though. Erica: Actually, one of our friends is married because she was- Kenrya: One of those friends. Erica: One of those friends. Kenrya: That's right. Erica: And it wasn't even on some... They weren't particularly close. It was just like a girl, "I'm trying to-" Kenrya: "I'm in town." Erica: "I'm in town. I'm trying to see this nigga. Come meet us, because he's bringing his friend." Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Erica: Now these motherfuckers married, with a kid, a whole fucking established life. It is the craziest thing. Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Erica: But also- Kenrya: We got another friend who met their person like that too. Erica: Oh, yeah. But they're a little closer, so that makes [crosstalk 00:49:56]. Kenrya: Yeah, yeah but still. Erica: These are the motherfuckers that give niggas hope. Kenrya: It's a thing. Erica: They see that, and they're like, "See, it's possible." Yo, that is wild. Isn't weird that we're of the age where we can be like, "Yo, I was at the party that they met at. I remember-" Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative), yeah. I ended up being the official photographer for one of our friends at the start of their relationship. When they got to their anniversary, they hit me up like, "You got pictures, right?" Erica: Oh, I- Kenrya: From the first time they met. Erica: I remember, that day was epic. We had a good time that night. Kenrya: Yeah. Yeah. Erica: We can literally be like, "That day," the specific day they met. Kenrya: Literally the day that y'all met. Erica: And now they're married with kids, living a whole entire life. They've built a life together. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Goddamn. Dammit. I was going to say, I'm old and complaining about it, but you know what, I am happy that I have been able to live and experience these things. Kenrya: Absolutely. Erica: I was always one of the... Even to this day, I'll be like, my single ass, "He got a cousin? He got a daddy?" Oh, I got a shirt for Christmas. It says, "If you see me with your daddy, mind your business." Kenrya: Mind your business, yeah. Erica: It's like, you knew me. It's so perfect. Kenrya: It's perfect. Erica: I think I have always been... I'd bring a friend, and they don't even know. I'm like, "Girl, just come on." They're like, "What the fuck?" Yeah, I mean whatever. Kenrya: Sometimes it works out. Erica: Yeah, sometimes it works out. Sometimes it don't. Okay, that's all I got. You got anything else for us, Kenrya, before we move on to our next segment? Kenrya: I'm trying to think. Yes. Erica: Okay. Kenrya: Okay, so we were talking about how previous relationships that Malcolm had been in, chicks had issues with Joy. If you were the chick on the other side of that equation, if you were Summer, because Summer kept trying to talk to Joy. How would you approach the situation if you were the new girlfriend in the scenario, and dude had somebody he was close to in that way? Thinking about how Summer approached it, how would you approach it? Erica: This reminds me of a story, and this is going to sum up my mother in one story. I was married. I was having all these fucking issues... Not all these issues. I was having... Damn, do I even need to tell that story? Fuck it. So, I was having these issues with my ex-husband and his mother. Let's make it very clear, it was not like some meddling issues. It wasn't that. It was just like, married, blending families, complications. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: So, I called my mom and I'm like, "Mama, this is what's going on. I don't know what to do." Mama was like, "Hm, I only dated niggas whose mamas was dead." Kenrya: True. Erica: What? Kenrya: Goddamn it, that's your mama. Erica: Dammit, Judy. Dammit. So, I thought about that as you tell this story, because I'm kind of like, that wouldn't even be my motherfucking problem. Like, "Bro, I got to go." Here's the thing, I recognize how important my friendships are to me, and if you can't keep that separate and keep me out of this shit, then I don't want it. I feel like that would never be me, because either you know my best friend don't fuck with you... It's kind of like you, and I love your partner, but you're not one of those people that "We all going to go on a trip together." That just ain't you. Erica: So, it's totally fine if I was like, "I don't really fuck with your partner," because all right- Kenrya: Unless it was a real, like this nigga kicks puppies. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: Or pinches babies. Erica: Exactly, but if you're like, "Okay, fine." And to keep us apart, but it's like that's not where we are. That's not what we do. If you're like me, and if you wanted me to kick it with your people, great. But you're going to kick it with my motherfucking crew. So, if you're like me and you and... I'm thinking of Kelly, and what's Issa's brother? Kenrya: Oh, fuck. God, they hate each other. That shit is cold. [crosstalk 00:55:22]. Erica: ... attention like that. Generally, no I'm not even going to be a part of that situation. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: What about you? Kenrya: If I got to talk to her, then it's gone too far. Then I'm not good. Erica: That's kind of I feel, yeah. Kenrya: To me, it is the person in the middle's job to set boundaries and hold them. For example, when my partner and I first got together, he had a best friend. I never met her. She lives out of town, but- Erica: I remember this. Kenrya: Yeah. She was leaving inappropriate comments on his posts and things like that. Erica: Calling at inappropriate times. Kenrya: I didn't like that shit. Yeah, and I was like, "Nah. Nah, this is disrespectful and you need to nip that shit in the bud." Erica: And- Kenrya: And he didn't- Erica: Oh, sorry. Kenrya: Oh, go ahead. Erica: Keep going. Kenrya: He didn't necessarily at first think that she was being disrespectful, because it was just the way that they had related for so many years. But he heard that it made me uncomfortable, and he talked to her, and that shit stopped. Erica: I think that as a friend, you need to know, "Oh shit-" Kenrya: "This is serious. Oh y'all not just fucking around." Erica: Yeah, if you come to me and be like, "Hey, my girl-" me in this situation with this dude, I'm always going... The nature of our relationship, in spite of us being friends, there is going to be a level of inappropriateness between us on some friendship shit. Like, nigga I done seen your dick. No, bro. Had I not cut it off- Kenrya: You would have been- Erica: I would have been cut off. Kenrya: You wouldn't have been to cut that. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: And that's essentially what happened in my situation. Erica: I'm fine with it. Kenrya: Sorry, not sorry. I'm not sorry at all, because he told her, and she did, she backed off, but also I think it changed their relationship. But it needed to because- Erica: Because you weren't... When the ways of a man [crosstalk 00:57:39] child, and a child in a man. Corinthians 22. Kenrya: Yes, we are grown-ups now, and he is in a grown-up ass relationship. I didn't have to step in, and I wouldn't have, and that's the thing. If it gets to the point where I feel like I got to say something, then I wish you well. Erica: Mm-hmm (affirmative), yep. [inaudible 00:57:58]. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Okay, well. Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: That is it for the penultimate discussion of season two. We will take a break and be back with our segment. Kenrya: What's Turning Us On. Kenrya: Hey y'all, today's a great day to start your own podcast. Whether you're looking for a new marketing channel, have a message you want to share with the world, or just think it'd be fun to have your own show like us, podcasting is an easy, inexpensive and fun way to expand your reach online. Buzzsprout is hands down the easiest and best way to launch, promote, and track your podcast. Kenrya: Your show gets put online, and listed in all the major podcast directories like Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google, literally everything, within minutes of finishing and uploading your recording. We use it here for The Turn On, and I can truly attest to the fact that it's pretty fucking dope. Podcasting isn't hard when you have the right partners, and the team at Buzzsprout is passionate about helping you succeed. So, join over 100,000 podcasters like us, who are already using Buzzsprout to get their message out to the world. Kenrya: Just click the link in our show notes, and you'll be able to get your own account set up. If you sign up for a paid plan, you'll get a $20.00 Amazon gift card and support our show. Let's create something great together. Sign up for Buzzsprout today. Erica: Okay, we're back. We are going to talk about what is turning me on. Back in episode seven and a half, when we interviewed with Jamila White, she talked about this book “Jambalaya,” because we were talking about crystals and your intuition, and Crystal Pussy Twitter keeps coming up in my head. Kenrya: Yeah, yeah. Erica: Anyway, this book, “Jambalaya,” is really great. I think I told you, I am re-examining where I am spiritually, like how does this fit in with Christianity, and the shit that I taught. I feel like this is tightly aligned with where I am sexually, my philosophy as a sex educator, and yada-yada-yada. This book, “Jambalaya,” was introduced to me a while back because it has not only... It's not only information about African traditional religion, it talks about reclaiming your magic as a divine being. Erica: It also has in here rituals. It has in here rituals. It also has little bios of important folks, like Marie Laveau. So, I like this because this is kind of my one stop intro into... I'm sorry, this light is hitting this crazy. This is my one-stop intro as I delve into African traditional religions. Actually, I need to look at this because I need to put a... I have my dog's ashes, and I'm like, "Can I put this on my altar or not?" Erica: Anyway, this book is great. I guess you can read it from top to bottom, but for me it's just kind of been one of those things where I have been bouncing around- Kenrya: Dipped in, like a resource. Yeah. Erica: Yep. This is great. I love it. I think everyone, if you were in a space where you're trying to figure out your relationship to your spirituality and religion, definitely give it a try. It's called “Jambalaya,” and I will include a link in the... I was about to say in the bio. In the show notes. Kenrya: Go. All right. Erica: All right, so that's it. Erica and Kenrya, two hoes making it clap. Kenrya: Okay, bye. [theme music] Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Hit subscribe right now in your favorite podcast app and at YouTube.com/TheTurnOnPodcast, so you'll never miss an episode. Erica: Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. And you can find links to books, transcripts, guest info, what's turning us on, and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Kenrya: And don't forget to email us at [email protected] with your book recommendations and your pressing sex-and related questions. Erica: And you can support the show by leaving us a five-star review, buying some merch or becoming a patron of the show. Just head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to make that happen. Kenrya: Thanks for listening and we'll see you soon. Holla.
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Amazon Music | Apple Podcasts | Google Play | iHeart Radio | Pandora | Radio Public | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn | YouTube CONNECT WITH THE TURN ON Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | Goodreads | Patreon SHOW NOTES In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya talk to matchmaker and dating expert Chi Love about inviting love into your life, the importance of compatibility before chemistry, trying different things to get different results, mental health and dating, arranged marriages, and the value of using a matchmaker to find your mate(s). RESOURCES
ADVERTISEMENT Buzzsprout The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information. TRANSCRIPT Kenrya: Come here. Get off. [theme music] Kenrya: Today we're talking to Chi, pronouns she and her. She's the CEO and founder of NYA Love and Dating Services. She's also a certified matchmaker and dating specialist who enjoys working with singles all over the United States ages 26 to 68 who are single, entanglement free and serious about their search to find true love. I love the parameters. We are gonna have to talk about that. Kenrya: Her goal is to help others navigate the ups and downs of dating and relationships. She's determined to provide a matchmaking and dating service that continues to help her community thrive in the dating world. She's been nicknamed The Love Genie, as she does very best to make wishes come true. Her hope is to continue changing the world one heart at a time. Hey, Chi. Chi: My pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. Erica: Thanks for joining us. So, Kenrya has questions that she wrote out, but I always like to go a little off. So, we knew we wanted a matchmaker, right? So, we saw these best of... You then got to sort, find Black people, right? We sort and it was like, "Oh, those are Black faces." Then what really turned us on about you and your service is that one, you got Black people on your page. It is clear that you're Black and you're Blackity Black, and also it's clear... Kenrya: And that you care about Black people and [crosstalk 00:01:54] pages in. Erica: Can I talk about the picture? If we have to, we'll cut this part out. So, we were looking and there was this one chick and she had a website and this Black man had the worst fucking haircut on Earth, to the point where you could tell you don't know Black people if you thought that this was an acceptable photo to put on your fucking landing page. I was like, "Hell no." Kenrya: Yeah. It was real bad. Erica: I was like, "I ain't even going no further than this." Kenrya: It was an instant move on. Erica: But also, you make it clear that you work with not just cis het folk, but all of us, which we thought was so important. And it's great to... I mean, other people may do it, but from this front you were Black and inclusive. And so, we were like, "Yes." Kenrya: And what was wild is that we were both going through lists separately and then we were emailing each other our favorites at the same time and you were both of our favorite [crosstalk 00:03:00]. Erica: Very happy you agree. Chi: Thank you. Erica: Yes. Okay. So, back to Kenrya's questions, I probably will veer again. Kenrya: We're definitely going to veer because I got questions about how you pick who you work with, which I should- Erica: [Crosstalk 00:03:19]. What did you want to be when you grew up? Chi: So many things. I know I really just wanted to be happy. I wanted to be famous. I wanted to be wealthy, but I didn't really have a specific thing that I wanted to be. I know in seventh grade I was very fond of Maya Angelou and I was like, "I want to be a poet. I want to be a writer. I just want to write because I love writing." And when I read “I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings,” that's the title of it, I fell in love with literature in itself. So, I think I wanted to be a writer and a poet at a young age. Like, "That's what I really want to do." And mainly because of Maya Angelou because she was everything. When “Phenomenal Woman” came out, even still, it just gives me goosebumps. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: Yes. Absolutely. So, how did you get from there to here? How did you become a matchmaker? Chi: Yeah. So, I saw this movie, “Hitch,” with Will Smith and he was- He was such a good dating coach and he was funny and I was like, "Oh, I like him. I've always loved Will Smith, but I love what he's doing." And so, I Googled one day, because I live in Washington state, matchmakers in my area. Let me see if I can try to see what's around here. Nobody looked like me. I was like, "Oh, okay. So, not many people are doing this." And then, I got even more curious about what it would take to become a matchmaker. So, I started doing my research on different institutes and certifications and then I found the Matchmaking Institute and they have been the only matchmaking institute, if you will, to actually have someone go on to have their own show, which was The Millionaire Matchmaker. Chi: So, I was like, "You know what? If I'm going to do this, I'm going to have to do it big." And so, I went with the Matchmaking Institute and they're based out of Manhattan. And it was very challenging in some ways to get started. It took me a while before I finally bit the bullet, but I was ready. And I launched February 2020 and I was excited because it's Black History Month, the month of love. And literally, less than two weeks after my announcement on Facebook and Instagram, "This is my website." COVID happened. I was like, "Wait a minute." Erica: But I feel you probably... I mean, I am single. So, I was thinking "Girl, find somebody to snuggle in the middle of this pandemic." Kenrya: Right. Chi: It was a little bit of both. I had people that were like, "Oh, I'm not trying to meet anybody new. Let me see what's going on with this pandemic. We're supposed to stay six feet apart and you're telling me to come together." And I'm like, "Okay. You right." So, I had to expand and that's how my business grew. So, instead of staying in Washington state, I opened up my business to the US. So, anyone who's born and raised in the US or currently residing in the US, I wanted to work with them. And then, my business just grew and grew and grew. Erica: Look at God. Chi: Yeah. So, the pandemic was a blessing and a curse, but I focused on the positive side of things. I had to. Yeah. Kenrya: Wow. Yeah. And you were flexible, which is important. Chi: Very flexible. Yes. Very important as well. Erica: So, who or what inspires you to do this work? Chi: People, especially in our community, our people. A lot of people say, "Oh, I'm giving up on love." Or, "There's no more good ones out there." And I'm just like, "What? There's 7.8 billion people and counting. If you're patient enough to wait for it and do the work and be open and honest about what it is that you need and want and designing your life, it could happen for you." But it all comes down to mindset. Chi: I mean, I remember I went through a very traumatic breakup and I was like, "I'll never love again. It's done for me. I'm good." All this extra stuff. And I'm just like, "Yeah." That's the thing a lot of people have. But if you think about it, you still have air in your lungs. So, why not go out there and just see what's available to you? As long as you are living and breathing, you might as well invite love into your life. Just be patient about it when it comes to the process and meeting new people and be open and honest. It's not an easy thing, but it's a beautiful thing when it works out. So, people inspire me, people that still believe in love in 2022, that's what inspires me. Kenrya: That's what's up. So, okay. I want to revisit something from your bio. So, you have ages 28 to 68 who are single and entanglement free and serious about their search to find true love. How did you come to that set of criteria for folks that you will take on? Chi: Yeah. So, I used to say 30. I wanted to start off with 30 because I feel like 30, people, they're really more excited and more serious, but then I met some really adventurous 28-year-olds. By that time, you've already graduated from college, most of them. Some of them are already career focused and all they're missing is that missing piece. And it's two years before 30, so they're trying to find that person right before. So, I figured 28... That's my starting point. Chi: Now, I have worked with people slightly younger, but again, it just depends on who they are. But generally speaking is 28 up until 68, because 70... I mean, I feel like I can be hard sometimes, a lot of people are set in their ways. But I've been lenient if I like your heart and if I can just see that you truly want this and if I like your energy too. Because I don't want to shut someone away just because of their age, if they're really looking. But I have to also be honest. "Well, this is the majority of what I'm working with as far as clientele. So, it may take me a little bit longer, but if you're patient enough, I'll do my best to help you in any way I can." I just feel like those ages are where I could take people more serious, but not always, just generally, if that makes sense. Kenrya: Yeah. And tell me about the entanglement. Chi: Yeah. So, I love Will Smith and Jada. I love them a lot, but I did get the entanglement... I did get that whole... I don't even know what to call it. That term from Jada, what she said. Because I want people that are just ready. I don't want people that are still involved with someone else or still got something over. Because if I introduce you to someone that's just ready to love you and you're still over here with this person that doesn't really serve you, then maybe they give you what you want in bed, but they don't give you what you want relationship wise. Then you're just wasting my time. Chi: So, please just be entanglement free and ready for something real because a lot of people are just out here wanting something to lay with, which is fine, but that's not what I do. I'm trying to introduce you to someone that you want to say I do to. So, when you come to me, just be entanglement free, I ask that respectfully. Kenrya: Right. What's your favorite thing about what you do? Chi: I love seeing people come together and like, "Ugh, you know what? I know I said that it's important that he'd be six feet tall, but 5'10" is just as good and we're working out just fine." Or people that stopped believing in it. I had this one gentleman who was 66 and he did not believe that I'd be able to help him because he's been in the army for 30 years. He's a retired vet and he's divorced. And he was just like, "It's hard. Dating out there is difficult." But I coached him. I coached him for several months and I gave him homework and he was able to approach a woman, take her out to dinner and now they're still dating and it's been months. Chi: He didn't even need me as a matchmaker anymore, but he believed and he wanted to try something different and he was nervous. He didn't think that he should, he was like, "What can a 30-year-old woman or thirties, tell me about dating." I'm like, "Sir, you are 66. You still have air in your lungs. Let's just try this coaching and see how it does." And when I gave him homework, he was, "You will give me homework? I'm a grown man." I'm like, "Sir, what did you pay me for? Come on." But he was successful. He approached a woman at the grocery store, approached a woman at the gym, the one at the grocery store said yes, they had dinner and they've been dating ever since. Chi: And it's beautiful stories like that. Love can be found at any age. You just got to be willing to try something different. You can't keep going to the same places and complaining about the people that you're meeting. You got to step outside of your comfort zone and try something new. So, yeah. That's what makes me happy, is actually changing people's love lives. Giving them hope again, because a lot of people have lost it, sadly. Erica: I feel like I'm going to be like... Yeah. I feel like I'm going to [crosstalk 00:10:58]. Yeah. All right. Let's go. You're a lovely woman, but I will probably tell you multiple times over this interview, stay out of my business. Kenrya: That's okay. What's the most challenging part of your work? Chi: Okay. So, I would say 75% of my clients, sometimes more, are women. Women usually know what they want. Men take too much time trying to sow their royal oats or whatever you want to call it. Or [inaudible 00:11:39] probably gets in the way, "I don't need a matchmaker." "But you do though, sir, you do. You're trying to find a wife though, right? I'm confused." Or you're trying to find a husband just depending on how you identify. But when it comes to men and matchmaking, finding melanated, marriage-minded men, that has been the hardest thing for me because I'm very specific. And some of my clients aren't as patient. Chi: So, we have to have the conversation. Valentine's Day, last month. "So, have you found me a..." "No. I know it's around Valentine's Day. I know you want them now, but I have your criteria. I know what you're looking for, but the people I'm screening, they're not measuring up." I have clients that they want to find someone that wants to get married within the next two years or want to have children within the next two years because of the biological clock. And I understand all of that. They've been to the doctors, they've frozen their eggs. I get that. Chi: But I'm not going to just introduce you to someone willy-nilly just to say, "Here's your match." I want them to be someone that you can see yourself saying ‘I do’ to, I want you to be aligned on many different things. I focus on the needs. A lot of people, they focus so much on chemistry. I'm focusing on compatibility and hoping that there's chemistry because chemistry is a thing, "Oh. She is so fine, I cannot wait to get to know her." "Oh I love the way he smelled." But then like, "Oh. You have seven kids and you don't want marriage. Okay. Cool." You're not compatible, right? Chi: So, the hardest challenge for me is getting people to focus on compatibility versus chemistry. That's a challenge. Because everybody wants to go off, "Oh. Well, he has to look this way." Or, "She has to be built like this." I'm just like, "Does she, though? Does he, though?" Because if you're 70, 80, 90 years old, I promise you that six pack or that fat ass isn't going to matter to you as much. [crosstalk 00:13:11]. Erica: Cute can get ugly real fast, that's what my grandma used to say. Cute can get ugly real fast. Chi: It really can. I mean, I'm here for. It's a challenge, though, it is. I have a lot of in-depth conversations. I have to bring people back to Earth and I always tell people, "If you don't like a really direct approach and if you're not patient, I'm not the matchmaker for you. I'm not going to hold your hand and tell you what you want to hear. I'm going to be real with you." I'm very honest. I had a past client, she was in her mid-fifties. She demanded he'd be six feet tall, six figures, in shape with no gray hair. Erica: You're marrying or whoring? Kenrya: But also a child because no gray hair? Chi: And I asked her, I was like, "Let's have another conversation, but let's revisit this conversation. I'm finding men for you, they just want to date you, want to get to know you, but they have some gray..." "No." "Honey, if I could dye my hair, so can he." So, she's no longer a client of mine. I wish her the best luck in her search. So, that's the thing. Kenrya: So, what does it look like to you? Because I think we all know... Well, most of us know what it looks like to get on an app and look for somebody. What does it look like to work with a matchmaker? Chi: So, every matchmaker is different. I've coined myself as NYA Love and Dating Services is the name of my company, but I'm also not your average matchmaker. That's what NYA stands for. So, I go above and beyond. I'm always head hunting. It is exhausting. I'm siding in DM's, I'm on LinkedIn looking for the professionals. Because it's an everyday thing and I can't be shy. If I see someone that I feel will be a good fit for my client. I'm walking up to them. Chi: Checking for a ring first. If they don't got one, "Hi, my name is Chi. Are you single?" "Excuse me?" "Oh, I'm a matchmaker." "Oh, are you?" And then, people don't believe that matchmakers exist so, "I could show you my website. Let's have a conversation." And then, it's the screening, going over deal breakers. I even talk about pets. There's some people that would date someone that has one pet, but not two. Kenrya: I couldn't [crosstalk 00:15:09]. Chi: That's what I'm saying. What if he's a great fit for you [inaudible 00:15:13]? Kenrya: Because I'm allergic to cats. They would kill me. Erica: I love dogs. I love dogs. And I used to have a dog and if I saw a guy with a dog, I was like, "No. Because you're not going to love my baby." "Mind you, I have a child." I was like, "You ain't going to love my baby the same way I love mine." Chi: Yeah. And there's so many things to consider. There's so many parameters. I talk about everything. The consultation is an hour and 15 minutes of me asking you about who you are and what you're looking for. And it has to be done on video. I do not take consultation with people. "Oh, just give me a phone call." No, I need to see your face when I ask, "What did your last relationship teach you?" If you're like, "Oh, well..." No. [crosstalk 00:16:02]. Look at the camera like, "I'm over here, sir." Or, "Ma'am, are you okay?" I've had people break down during consultation, just start crying. I don't think you're ready to date. Erica: I feel like a huge part of it... Yeah. Especially with the dating culture, it is therapy. Chi: It is, essentially. I mean, I do find myself doing a lot of therapeutic type things, but I always tell people I'm not a licensed therapist, but I will recommend one if I feel like it's necessary. I think that therapy's a beautiful thing that we should not shy away from, especially in our community. I also do talk about mental health in my consultations, because God forbid, someone's hiding the fact that they have schizophrenia and I'm trying to introduce you to someone. Or you have multiple personalities, I want to know who are they going to meet. Chi: So, that's another question I have to have with people and it's kind of uncomfortable, but I've had people reveal, "Oh. The last matchmaker didn't ask me about mental." I'm like, "Okay. Well, I will." Per HIPAA, obviously you don't have to share anything that you feel really uncomfortable disclosing. But if you're hiding something like that, that's major. There's so much stuff that I do that people don't even realize, but I wouldn't have it any other way. I wouldn't. It feeds my soul. I wake up ready to do what I got to do, but it's an ongoing thing. There are no breaks, really. Even when I'm on vacation, I'm looking. Erica: New city, new clients. Chi: Always. Kenrya: Oh, that's interesting. And I mean, thinking about the mental health thing, about... It's interesting, right? Because it's a set of things that you have to decide at what point do you disclose certain things about yourself, right? Because it's not everybody's business what you have going on with your mental health, with your physical health, with your sexual, with a whole bunch of different stuff. So, it makes me think of this question of at what point do you disclose those things? And if you disclose them to the matchmaker, does that mean that you've also disclosed them to any potential people that you're dating? How does that- Chi: Oh, great question. Okay. So, here's the thing, right? If someone tells me straight up, "I've suffered from depression, but I've been in therapy." I also ask them... Another part of that question or the equation is, "Okay, are you open to dating other people that have also suffered from depression?" Because it's very common. Depression and anxiety is the most common thing, especially in our community. And mind you, I launched in February 2020, so the consultation was heavy. It's rough. We saw a lot. We're always seeing a lot as a Black community, but it was really heavy in 2020. Chi: So, after asking that question and find out what they're dealing with. "Oh, you know what? I can definitely date someone who has depression because I know how to cope with it. I've been in therapy." And then, there are other people like, "I can't deal with it. I have myself to consider. It's something that I'm uncomfortable with, but I can deal with someone who has anxiety, because that makes me feel like I can just help them through that versus them being sad all the time or not knowing how to make them happy." I'm like, "Okay." Chi: Everyone is different. But I always ask, "Is there anything you're struggling with? And are you comfortable dating someone else who's struggling?" And I get varied answers. "If they're in therapy, great." Or, "I don't mind because I do too." Or, "Only if it's a situational thing." Like a parent passed away or a child, that depression is real and understandable versus, this is something I use medication for, right? So, everyone's different. But I have to ask the questions. I do. And it gets really deep. I've cried in consultations. I've laughed really hard till I was crying in consultations. I love consultations. That's how I get to connect with people. Chi: And sometimes we're a great fit, and sometimes we're not. If I don't like your energy or your negative, I can't help you. And that's what I had to learn, because in 2020 I said yes to everybody, "I'm a matchmaker. I can help you and you, you're all getting husbands and wives." But I learned really quickly I can't do that. So, in 2022, I know how to say "No, this is not going to be a good fit, my love. We'll have to go to someone else." Or because my website, I have some people, some white men that'll reach out to me, "Oh, I'm looking for a sister." I'm like, "Okay, sir. Let's learn more about that." "Yes. She has to be brown or really dark skin." I'm like, "Okay. Well, is this a fetish?" "I mean, well, it's a fetish, but I still want to marry." "No, sir. No. Just no. I wish you the best." "Oh, you're not going to help me? I could pay." "It's not about you paying." Chi: I want to make sure that people I'm introducing are going to love people for who they are, not just because it's a fetish or something like that. You know what I mean? So, there's a lot of stuff that I do, but I'm the gatekeeper for my business, right? As a matchmaker, I want to protect my clients. I want to protect their hearts. Obviously, do the very best I can to introduce them to someone that they will truly like, although there are no guarantees because I'm focusing on needs. Kenrya: Yeah. I want to say, as someone who has mental health issues, for everyone who is listening, we know that whether we use medication or we use therapy or we self-manage, that we are still deserving of love and companionship and that those things are not disqualifying. Erica: My anxious ass is. Chi: I'm so glad you said that. Kenrya: I feel so blessed in that my partner is so wonderful and talking through my anxiety with me and it's something I told him early on, but everybody comes to that in a different way in terms of how they disclose and that kind of thing. And it's a lot, it can be a lot or it can be easy. Chi: Yes. Erica: It's important to have... And I love that you asked that question because also, it makes it normal and I feel like if you talk to someone and they're like, "I don't believe in that shit. I don't do that shit." I'm like, "Well, all right." Kenrya: Then that person... Erica: I mean, as someone who's dating, you ask all the questions and get them out the way so that you can really... I find when I meet someone it's like, "Oh. I'm so excited. Please don't let this motherfucker turn on R Kelly in the car." That kind of shit, right? You'd be like, "He's great." And you're waiting for the other shoe to drop. So, you get all that out the way. Chi: Yeah. So, you can just focus on if there is chemistry or not, all of those little questions that you would ask, do you have kids? All that, I already explained, I already have all that information. Even down to politics, I started adding, are you open to dating a Tr*mp supporter? Because I've been surprised before. I've heard everything. And that's a major thing, politics and religion and kids, those three always come up. Always. Chi: And then, cigarettes, major deal breaker for many. But then, some people are okay with people smoking cigars like, "Oh, you can have a celebratory cigar every now and then. If you're celebrating something, you can go to a cigar lounge, but not cigarettes." And then, some people, they could be 420-friendly, but not cigarettes. So, it's just so many nuances, but I ask all the questions as much as I can. Kenrya: That's pretty cool. I think a lot of people are afraid to ask the questions. We've been watching “Love is Blind” and being so blown away at the things that people are afraid to ask each other. But if you don't have those conversations right away, then you look up weeks, months in and realize that you have all these incompatibilities because you were afraid to talk about these things right up front. I mean, that was definitely me and my 20s, but I'm grown now. Erica: I also like how you said, "I take care of compatibility so you can focus on chemistry." Chi: Yes. Kenrya: That's dope. Erica: I met this guy, he was great. But I kept saying, "He don't make my pussy sparkle." That's chemistry, right? And it's great to be able... I mean, he was a great guy. And so, being able to just focus on the chemistry part was actually refreshing now that I look back on it. So, yeah. Kenrya: But I heard, but you just- Erica: Because you got to make my pussy sparkle. [crosstalk 00:23:59]. You got to make it like a little sparkler. Okay. We're a sex podcast so we use erotica as a jumping off point for conversations about lots of things, including sex. So, we like to ask about the lessons folks learn when they're young. So, what was the prevailing attitude about sex and sexuality and gender in your home growing up? Chi: Oh. All right. So, I grew up in a Nigerian-Christian home and I was told to wait until I was married. That did not work out for me. I was kind of the black sheep, I would say. Because I was the first one to explore my sexuality. I came out to my family as bisexual, which later turned to lesbian, which now I fully know that I am pansexual. And I don't think my family knew how to take that. There were a lot, "Let's pray the gay away." I've had a holy ghost. I've had people lay hands on me and at church gatherings and whatnot. And I just let them pray but I still love women afterwards. Chi: I appreciate the efforts and I still believe in God. I'm so grateful for my blessings. But what I learned in my childhood versus what life showed me is completely different. And I just want to be happy and me identifying as pansexual, but hetero-romantic, that's a whole nother thing. But I had to come to terms of what that meant, right? So, being someone who's been in every type of relationship you can imagine, I don't shy away from any type of conversations. When people tell me, "Oh, I've tried this." Or, "I've tried that." Or, "I've been with my spouse for this long, but I'm thinking about other people." Or, "I have this kiss in college with a woman, but now I'm still thinking about her and I've been married for 20 years. Can you help?" I'm like, "Yeah, let's have this conversation." Chi: Nothing scares me when it comes to life and love and sex because we're all just humans trying to find our way and society makes it really difficult for us to be proud and stand in who we are because we're taught from an early age this is not right. Especially if you're raised in a religious household, "You can't do this, you shouldn't do this." And I've met the biggest hypocrites in the church. And I'm not saying that everyone that goes to church is hypocrite, but I'm seeing some things and I'm not going to talk about the Catholic church. So, all I'm saying is I encourage everyone to be happy, do whatever makes your soul sing. That's what you should do, and explore. Chi: Me personally, I've been in polyamorous relationships before. I've dated women. I've dated men. I've dated a couple before, they were married. I've dipped and dived and experienced. And now I know exactly who I am. And I think that everyone's different. Sometimes you need to experience things to know what you like. And sometimes you just know, but to each their own, just do whatever makes you happy and fuck what society has to say, because they're not going nowhere. Society will be what society's going to be, but you have to live with your decisions. So, yeah. Erica: This might be a pedestrian question. And tell me [inaudible 00:27:06] simple ass question, would you be open to matching a couple or a polyamorous... Well, a couple or a pod. I mean, I feel like that would be so fucking difficult, right? If it's everyone together. Chi: That's the thing. I've been approached before like, "Can you help us find a third?" And I'm like, "You know what? I don't discriminate at all, but that's just not my ministry. That's just not what I'm doing right now." It's too much hard to find a match for one person, but two. And then, I'm going to go with in depth like, "Oh, let's talk about love languages. What is your love language? And your spouse’s love language? What is their love..." It's just too much. [crosstalk 00:27:49]. Erica: I feel like that's a jump from arithmetic to algebra. Chi: Basically. Yeah. No, I would not. But I'm sure there's somebody out there that does and there're different sites. I'm sure they can find something. I see a lot of people post on dating apps as a couple. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: Yeah. For sure. Erica: Speaking of apps... [crosstalk 00:28:13]. Why might someone go with a matchmaker instead of using the apps? Chi: Yeah. So, it's just more of an in-depth experience, right? And I do run background checks. I do run background checks. On an app you can't really... I mean, you can get some information, but mostly, they're not running background checks. That's one thing. Also, there're certain things that I'll ask you that you won't get from a dating app. I mean, they'll say stuff like your height, your age, where you're located. Sometimes children, sometimes pets, but doesn't dive as deep. People can put stuff in their bio, but not everyone's going to be as thorough. So, I have this whole one hour 15-minute conversation. We've only been speaking here... What? I don't know. 28 minutes. And there's already been a lot that you've learned, but an hour and 15 minutes where I'm connecting with you one on one, I have everything about you. All the good things, all the things that I need to know in order to correctly match you with someone else, right? Chi: So, you can't get all that on a dating app. But the bonus of having a dating app is all the options. So, it takes a lot of time, but you can swipe and swipe and swipe until you find somebody you connect with and go from there. But then, you still have to ask all the questions. Whereas, I already have those questions answered for you. And I'm presenting this person to you, thinking that they are a good match for you, it's only up to you to decide what you want to do with it. So, I think that's the benefit of working with the matchmaker, it's more of an in-depth approach. And then, you get assistance throughout your dating experience. Not just, "Okay. You matched. Good luck." Kenrya: Right. No, that makes sense. Right. So, last week we read a book called “His Only Wife,” and it features a woman who marries a man who she doesn't know at the urging of their families. And it got us thinking about the ways that we go about looking for love, which is how we decided we wanted to have a matchmaker, which is how we found you and reached out. And you said yes, and all of those things. But so, one of the ways that some people, obviously, find folks are through arranged marriages, what do you think about taking that route to love? Chi: Honestly, I think that arranged marriage is a great idea, as long as they have some criteria of what you're looking for. Obviously, there can be some things that come up and chemistry, that's the major thing, because they may be compatible but you don't know about chemistry yet. But once you're in a marriage, it's a full on commitment. You are committed, the utmost commitment. So, I think it's a great idea for those that are open to do it. I mean, I would do it. I'm a little bit biased though, I think. But I would definitely do it. Chi: I mean, I just think it's important for people to just do whatever feels good to them, but just don't be that person that desires love, but just sits in the same corner every day and doesn't change anything about their love life. They're just sitting there, "Oh, well. Well, maybe one day they'll find me." I hate when people say that, "Oh, they're just going to find me how." Kenrya: Like they're going to materialize [crosstalk 00:30:55]. Erica: In the book, the main character Afi, she has trouble saying what she wants from her partner. And you mentioned that you see that come up in your intake. Chi: Yeah. Erica: How do you help your clients figure out what they are actually looking for? Chi: Yeah. So, my questions are really in-depth. They'll know exactly what they're looking for at the end of it. But people that struggle, I'm just like, "Listen. Very simple. We're all going to die one day as dark as that is, it's the truth. So, while you're on this Earth, why don't you focus on the things that bring you joy?" And if you're not getting something that you need that would bring you joy, it's best that you speak on it, right? Because what you don't want to do is end up resenting your partner, right? You don't want to just be sitting there pussy dry every time you're in the bedroom. For what? That's not fun for anyone. Chi: I want them to experience as much love and joy and happiness as this world has to offer, but with a closed mouth you'll never get fed. And everyone needs to eat. So, I just keep telling them like, "Your happiness matters. Open that beautiful mouth of yours and speak, because they won't know otherwise." There's some men that to this day, and I'm not trying to bash any men here, but they think that they're killing in the bedroom and she's just faking every orgasm. I don't remember what the statistics are, but a lot of women fake orgasms and heterosexual relationships and they shouldn't have to, right? Kenrya: Yeah. Chi: Let him know what feels good and if something needs work, then just tell him. I always say the sandwich method is the best approach where you start off with the bread like, "You know what honey? I really like the way you stroke it from the back. It feels really good." And then, in the middle it's just like, "But I like the foreplay at beginning more." Yeah. Chi: But you just got to hit them with the things that you really need in the middle. Like, "I need more foreplay. I need more kissing. I need you to make me feel more desire before we get into the bedroom." And then, end with the, "But I really like this." Or, "I really enjoy our sex life together. I just want us to be even more enjoyable." Because egos can get bruised really easily. No one really likes to hear that they're not performing as well, but it can only enhance the experience. So, just open your mouth and speak. Talk about the hard stuff. It'll pay off in the long run. Kenrya: Yeah. So, another theme in the book is that Afi really struggles with knowing who to take advice from, as it relates to her marriage. And she takes some really bad advice, particularly from her family, they're all fucked up. But it makes me think about what does it look like to build a healthy support system for people who are trying to create and maintain healthy, romantic relationships, right? I think about the fact that when you're married or in a long-term relationship, you need to have people who are friends of your marriage, who, when you have trouble, are not fucking haters. Erica: "Take your ass back home and talk to that woman, that man." Kenrya: Exactly. So, what does it look like to build a healthy support system to create and maintain healthy, romantic relationships? Chi: Yeah. So, two words, positive energy. You just want to surround yourself with people that have positive energy and people that are going to keep it real with you. You don't want the friend that's always going to be like, "Oh, it's okay. Everything's going to be fine." Because maybe they won't be. Maybe it won't be fine. Or maybe you're getting abused and you need to leave this man or woman or whatever the case may be. If you want to find your happiness, so you want people that are going to have positive energy, but also keep it real with you. Don't surround yourself with people that are just miserable all the time. Chi: There's some people that still have friends that no longer serve them, but they're keeping them in their lives. "Oh, well. We go back 15 years." Who cares? Because if that person is no longer adding joy to your life or speaking life into you, then what do you have them there for? Life is fucked. There's some really fucked up news happening right now. And just life. The world that we live in, there could be a lot of anger and suffering and sadness. You have to make sure that your circle has positive energy in it. These are people that are going to speak life and joy into you. Chi: It can get really rough out there without having a strong support system, but just pay attention to how you feel when someone's around in your circle. After you speak to them, do you feel completely depleted? Or do you feel happy and positive like you're make it through? You need people like that. Because I'm telling you, life could be hard sometimes. So, just focus on people that bring you joy and people that always have your best interests in mind, always. Positive energy. Erica: So, what is the number one piece of advice you would give to someone who is looking for love right now? Chi: Don't give up. It is rough out there, but for every person that you meet that is nothing like what you're looking for, there's going to be somebody that is. You just got to be patient. And try something different, try as many things as you can. There's some people that have tried the dating apps is not for them, they come to me. Great, you're trying something different. But I also encourage, in addition to me, go to meetup groups, go to singles events in your areas. Chi: Meetup.com is very good at having something to do in every single city. Every single city, they always have something to do. And I encourage all of my clients, "Oh, I hired you." "That's fine. In the process of me looking, make sure you get yourself out there, get comfortable talking to other single people, so when I get you on this date you're not like... What are you doing?" Just get out of your comfort zone, but don't give up on love. You are worthy of love and you are enough. So, I remind people that all the time, but they just have to hear it enough times. So, yeah. That's my best advice. Erica: Thank you. Kenrya: What's your superpower? Chi: This heart that beats in my chest, that's my superpower. Yeah. I have a lot of passion for what I do. I think that a lot of people would've given up. It is very tedious and it's a grind, but when people come together and they're looking at themselves eye to eye, face to face and they're kissing and holding and you're the reason why they're together and they found this love they didn't believe existed. That is everything. That gives me joy. That lights me up. So, yeah. I would say my heart and my passion, those are my superpowers for sure. Erica: Cool. So, we like to ask... Kenrya writes the questions and she gives me one question to ask and my question... Kenrya: That's not because I try to push you out, bitch. Erica: No, it's because the entire interview would be like the questions I'm about to ask, right? Which make absolutely no sense and have nothing to do with it. Kenrya: They're fun. Erica: Okay. So, we're going to play a little game. Chi: Oh, yes. Erica: That I call the perfect pair. Chi: Oh, okay. Erica: So, I'm going to give you a category. Chi: Okay. Erica: And you tell me the perfect pair. So, for example, food. Well, what I think is a perfect pair, Popeye's chicken and champagne. It's a perfect pair. Unexpected, but delightful. Chi: Yeah. Erica: So, food. Kenrya, you're going to have to answer this too. Kenrya: Ah, shit. Erica: So, tell me what you think is a perfect pair for food. Chi: Food. Chicken and a grill. Erica: Okay. Chi: Is that it? Erica: Yeah. Chi: I just like grilled chicken because I'm trying not to eat much fried. I love chicken taste grill. Erica: Okay. I'll give it to you. Anything tastes [inaudible 00:39:00] grill to be quite honest. Put a shoe on the grill and I'm like, "That bitch is good." What about you, Kenrya? Kenrya: Fish and spaghetti. Erica: Yes. Fish and spaghetti. Chi: That's good too. Kenrya: I was going to say rice and beans because I eat a lot of rice and beans, but fish and spaghetti is my all-time favorite. Erica: Okay. Colors. Chi: Red and gold. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya? Kenrya: I don't know. I mostly wear fucking charcoal with pops of neon. Black and white. Erica: Okay. I like blue and pink. A bright pink and a dark blue. Chi: I think royal blue is so sexy. Erica: Yes. Okay. Musical acts. Chi: Musical acts. Oh. Drums and dancing. No, that's not a musical act. I'm sorry. Circle back to me. Erica: What you got, Kenrya? Kenrya: Yeah. I don't know. Erica: Look in the notes. I wrote that for you. Kenrya: She put Jay-Z and Linkin Park because their mashup album that's one of my favorite mashup albums. That's true. I do very much love that. Thank you. Chi: That song [inaudible 00:40:44] together. I don't know. Kenrya: Yes. Yeah. “Numb” is on there. It's seven tracks and each of them is fantastic. Chi: So, we're talking about artists? Kenrya: Yeah. Chi: Okay. When I say act, I thought about a drummer and something. Okay. I'm overthinking it. I forgot her name. That is so sad and I love her. No, I remember her name now. Janelle Monáe and Jill Scott. That'd be interesting. Erica: That would be great. Kenrya: That would be good. Yeah. Erica: So, I'm simple. City Girls. Chi: I did not expect that at all. Erica: I told you I'm simple. Either that or Marvin Gaye and Tammi Terrell. They always make a good combination. Chi: I miss Marvin. Erica: So, yeah. Either throwing it back or throwing back Motown style. Chi: I'll take it. I love Motown. Erica: All right. So, that is the Erica questions for today. Kenrya: That was really... I like that perfect pair. That was cute. Chi: Yeah. That was cute. I like it. Kenrya: Yeah. All right. What are you reading right now? Chi: To be completely transparent? Nothing. I'm seriously just focused on clients. I'm not even... Erica: Reading these personalities. Chi: Yeah. Personalities. I'm definitely reading personalities. Every now and then I dip and dabble back into the “5 Love Languages” book because I think it's very interesting. And it does help. I do require all my clients to do the love language test before the consultation with me so I can have a good gauge of where they're at. But yeah, I'm reading personalities, reading files of clients, trying to put things together, all that constantly. Erica: Okay. Chi: Yeah. Kenrya: I was just looking back. I don't know why. I think I was looking back at old pictures or screenshots or something. My partner and I did that. I think it might have been before our first date or maybe between our first and our second date. We each did it and then screenshot the results and sent it to each other. And I was just looking back at how fucking true- Erica: Oh, my God. Kenrya: The results are. Erica: So, typically what I share with potential partners are my results for my BDSM test and that ranks your sexual kinks. Chi: Oh, my God. I talk about that too. Erica: I'm like, "I'm a sub and a rope bunny. What about you?" Chi: Yeah. It's [inaudible 00:43:28] bunny. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: That's so funny. I've never taken that test. Erica: I'll send you the link. Chi: It's long but worth it. Erica: Yeah. But it's fun. Kenrya: Yeah. Send it to me. Erica: So, what's turning you on today? Chi: Oh, today. What's turning me on today? Myself. I turn myself on today. I put some nice cocoa butter on my skin when I got out. And I'm touching my legs. So, I have a shorter dress on and my legs feel really smooth. So, I'm turning myself on today. Yes. Erica: I love it. Chi: Yes. I like that person so much. Me. Yeah. Erica: Yes. Cue Beyoncé's “Feeling Myself.” Chi: Yes. I'm having a good day. Kenrya: That's awesome. Yay. So, you were telling us that you quickly expanded. I'm wondering... From Washington state to all of the United States, what's next for you? Not necessarily expansion, but what's next with your business? What's next with what you're doing? Chi: Yeah. So, I am going to be having some singles events. I want to call it... Speed dating is cool and everything, but I want to remix it a little bit. So, not your average speed dating event and just have all type of things. Trivia that brings people together. I want to throw a love language game in there to get people to connect more. Maybe have a spades table, but have a trick to it. At the end, the winning couple group or something... I don't know. I'm just thinking of all these interesting things. Chi: But I want to have events where people come together and meet and mingle and just have a good time. That is the next thing on my agenda. And just continue matchmaking and meeting new people and networking. That's really it. But it's an ongoing thing, it never ends. Kenrya: Yeah. Chi: It never ends. But there's just so much joy that comes with what I do. I think that the thing that I always wish, though, is that I could just snap my fingers and have the perfect partner for someone right there. But there's so much that comes with that, there's so much. But my clients... I have amazing clients and the people that have chosen me to be their matchmaker, out of all the other people they should have chose. I feel blessed that I have such amazing people and it just makes me want to find them their person even more. Kenrya: That's great. Chi: Yeah. Kenrya: Well, after hearing that, I'm sure that there are lots of people who would like to find you, where can they find you online? Chi: Yeah. So, they can go directly to my website. It is www. N as in Nancy, Y as in Yankee, A as in apple, loveanddating.com. So, nyaloveanddating.com. If they want to add me on Instagram, they can feel free to do so as well. My alias there is @NYALoveByChi and Chi is spelled C-H-I. Kenrya: Dope. And it's the same handle on Twitter as well, right? Chi: That is correct. Yeah. They can follow me on Twitter @NYALoveByChi as well. Kenrya: Awesome. Chi: Yeah. Kenrya: So, you all go find her. Make that happen. Get some help with the love if that's what you all are looking for. Yes. In the meantime, thank you all for listening, but even more importantly, Chi, thank you for saying yes and coming on and talking to us today. Chi: I will always say yes to you all. I love your energy. I love what you're doing. I love the name of the podcast. Yes, I'm here for it. I'm so here for it. So, yes, thank you so much for having me. It was truly a pleasure. Kenrya: Yay. Awesome. Erica: You're so welcome. Thank you. Kenrya: I hope all of y’all also got some pleasure out of this episode and we appreciate you all for joining us and we'll see you all next time. Take care. Erica: Bye. Chi: Bye. [theme music] Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Hit subscribe right now in your favorite podcast app and at YouTube.com/TheTurnOnPodcast, so you'll never miss an episode. Erica: Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. And you can find links to books, transcripts, guest info, what's turning us on, and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Kenrya: And don't forget to email us at [email protected] with your book recommendations and your pressing sex-and related questions. Erica: And you can support the show by leaving us a five-star review, buying some merch or becoming a patron of the show. Just head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to make that happen. Kenrya: Thanks for listening and we'll see you soon. Holla. |
The Turn On
The Turn On is a podcast for Black people who want to get off. To open their minds. To learn. To be part of a community. To show that we love and fuck too, and it doesn't have to be political or scandalous or dirty. Unless we want it to be. Archives
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