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LISTEN TO THE TURN ON Amazon Music | Apple Podcasts | Google Play | iHeart Radio | Pandora | Radio Public | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn| YouTube CONNECT WITH THE TURN ON Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | Goodreads | Patreon SHOW NOTES In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya talk to Michelle B. about what ethical non-monogamists can teach us all about maintaining healthy relationships, what it looks like to have multiple partners during the pandemic, getting off the relationship escalator and leaving the dating scarcity mindset behind. RESOURCES
ADVERTISEMENT Clap Cleats | Use code THETURNON for 10% off your order. The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information. TRANSCRIPT Kenrya: So before we get started, we're here to do some begging. Erica: We are here to beg like 1980s and 1990 R&B stars like who? Keith Sweat. Kenrya: Keith Sweat, yeah. Remember when we saw him in concert? Erica: It was like the apex of niggas in linen pants, those little A tank tops, and Stacy Adams. Kenrya: It's true, but it was a damn good show. We were in our 20s when we went to that show. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: We were very young. Erica: Now I wouldn't be mad at a fine gentleman in some nice linen pants. Kenrya: Me too. And I can still appreciate the begging of Keith Sweat. Erica: Can we? Like he says, he begs to your woman so you don't have to. Kenrya: Exactly, but today we actually do have to beg. Erica: We doing our own begging, right? Kenrya: Yeah. And you don't have to break out your linen, but what we do want is for y’all to tell us what you think about the show. Erica: Yeah, so it sounds like work, I promise it does, but it's painless. All you're going to do is head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com/Survey and answer a few questions. It will help us give you more of what you love. Kenrya: Yes, help us, help you. Erica: Yeah. On the survey, is one of the questions, “Do you guys enjoy Erica singing?” Kenrya: That is not one of the questions on the survey. Erica: I feel like it should be. Kenrya: You think it should be? Erica: I feel like it should be, but whatever. Kenrya: Just yo, if you all give us a few minutes of your time, you can help us give you more of the show that you love. And all you got to do is head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com/Survey. Yes, please, and thank you. Erica: Okay, so let's start the show. Kenrya: All right. Kenrya: So back in my hoe days, I used to fuck this nigga who liked to fuck with his socks on. I used to always be like, "Why you ain't take off your socks?" And he'd be like, "Because I need some traction." And I was like, "Oh, okay." Erica: He was wearing the hospital joints? Kenrya: He was just wearing regular ass socks. Honestly I feel like- Erica: Slide around crew socks. Kenrya: ... his feet might've been a little fucked up, too, like he was embarrassed about his feet, but also he said it gave him some leverage and... Erica: Okay. Kenrya: Did better when he wore socks, right? Erica: I mean, yeah. I guess. Kenrya: Yeah. If he had some Clap Cleats- Erica: Clap Cleats! I love the name. Clap cleats. Kenrya: It is a really good name. Erica: The socks for your feet while you beat them cheeks under the sheets. Kenrya: That's not they tagline, but I kind of love it. So Clap Cleats- Erica: I kind of love it. Kenrya: I kind of do. They're made of a high-performance bamboo material, which makes them cooler than cotton. And they wick away sweat, because you know, if you really doing what you're supposed to be doing, you sweating everywhere. Erica: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Kenrya: This keeps you from being all sweaty in the feet, but they also have grips on the soles. Erica: Little grippers on the bottom? Kenrya: Yes, like hospitals socks but better, because hospital socks don't really do the job. Erica: And you throw your feet up on the wall and not have to worry about... You know, throw it back on the wall and not have to worry about sliding down. You become a gecko. Kenrya: Yes. See, everybody can wear these no matter what position you're going to be in! Erica: Exactly. Kenrya: Exactly. So you figure they got socks for everything. There's socks if you play certain sports. I'm sure there's socks for hiking for people who do shit like that. Erica: Fucking's a sport. Kenrya: Fucking is a sport, so why not make sure that you got your shit together with Clap Cleats? I'm just saying. Erica: Claplete. Fucking claplete. So in order to become a claplete, claplete, claplete... Yes. In order to become a claplete, go to ClapCleats.com, use the promotion code "TheTurnOn," all one word. Happy fucking. Kenrya: Yes. Erica: Clap Cleats. The socks for your feet while you beat them cheeks in the sheets. Kenrya: Oh my God. That's ClapCleats.com/discount/TheTurnOn, and then put in the code "TheTurnOn" all together for 10% off. Erica: Yay. Kenrya: Yay, now let's get started. Kenrya: Come here. Get off. [theme music] Kenrya: Hey, good people. Today we are talking to Michelle B., a social scientist and mom who happens to be polyamorous. Hey, Michelle. Michelle B.: Hey. Kenrya: Thanks for joining us. Michelle B.: Thank you for having me. Erica: Thanks for coming on, Michelle. Let's just jump right in. What was the prevailing attitude about sex in your home when you were growing up? Michelle B.: That sex is shameful, and sex is reserved for marriage, and that it is something that is primarily the domain of the man whose prerogative it is to pick out a woman that he finds desirable. Kenrya: So trying to “get chose.” Michelle B.: Yes. All about being chosen and being worthy and being pure. Kenrya: Wow. Was that rooted in religion, or? Michelle B.: I think so. But even beyond religion, I think ... I mean, even my mom didn't want me to go see a gynecologist when I was 18 because it's like everything should be perfect down there because you haven't been doing anything. So just sort of lacking general knowledge about women even just being comfortable with their own bodies and it just being this really taboo topic. Erica: How do you think that impacts the way you move through the world now? Michelle B.: Now I'm very intentional about being sex positive and being open and transparent with people, including my kid, that sex is a normal, natural, very human thing that people do, and it's really not a big deal. Kenrya: Okay. I'm wondering how did you get from there to here? How did you get from coming from people that were like, "Nah, don't do that," to being really intentional about not instilling that in your own child? Michelle B.: Yeah. I took the traditional path, and it sucked. I got married. I had a house with a picket fence and a dog and two kids, and I realized that this ideal of where, as a society, we place this burden on women to accomplish marriage and motherhood, that it just wasn't all it was cracked up to be. It wasn't what I thought it was going to be. Just because you pursue that particular pathway, it may be great for some people, but, for me, it just sort of pulled the veil back, that you can have all of these things that we say make you a woman, and it actually has nothing to do with your womanhood or your humanity. Kenrya: Word. Erica: We asked you to come on to the show today because we read this story called “Be Mine,” by Savannah J. ... Frierson? Kenrya: I've been saying Frierson in my head, but I don't know. Erica: Okay. And it featured- Kenrya: I'll look it up. Erica: Okay. Good. It featured a Black woman that found herself unexpectedly in a relationship with three men. Tell us about your journey to polyamory. That sounds like an album. Like the Ohio Players- Kenrya: Journey to polyamory? Erica: Journey to polyamory. Michelle B.: One thing I do want to clarify, I'm going to use an umbrella term of ethical non-monogamy because- Kenrya: Ethical non-monogamy. Michelle B.: ... polyamory falls under that, but not every relationship that I've had under the ethical non-monogamy umbrella has been polyamory. But- Kenrya: Thank you for that. Erica: Thank you. Michelle B.: ... basically, I had a span of years where I went through a divorce, and then I moved around a lot. I lived in three different major metro areas in a period of four to five years. I knew that I was going to be moving around a lot, and so the relationship escalator just wasn't an option for me. I mean, I still wanted to get laid and have fun and have- Erica: Bust it open. Michelle B.: ... companionship and all that good stuff, but I knew I was not going to be on the relationship escalator. And so that kind of opened me up to, okay, what kind of relationship could I have? One of the people that I dated was also in a transition kind of situation, where he was only going to be there for a year, so let's just have something casual. That was my first exposure to it. This was early, before OkCupid decided to brand themselves as the platform for ENM. Erica: I did not know that. Kenrya: Me neither. Michelle B.: Yeah. They have a whole interface where you indicate whether you're open to non-monogamy or strictly non-monogamy or whatever, which none of the other platforms, to my knowledge, do that. I haven't been on all of them. But, back then, nobody had that on their platform, Tinder, Match, OkCupid, whatever. I would meet people, and I would say, "Look, I'm only going to be living here for a certain amount of time. I know that I'm going to be moving. So I'm open to this." And, for the most part, guys were like, "Yeah, cool." That's sort of how that started. Michelle B.: I also had a relationship with a woman for my first polyamory, where I had two committed relationships with a man and a woman. I think that I learned a lot from that. It was really challenging because she really wanted to be in a permanent, monogamous relationship with me. I think that she agreed to non-monogamy because she wanted the relationship with me. And so, from that point, I became an advocate of enthusiastic consent, for not just consent in a sexual way, but consent for the form of the relationship, that we actually need to talk about what this means and what our boundaries are. That's a really important thing for me to do upfront. Kenrya: Word. I have never heard anyone use that term in that way. I love it. Erica: Wait. I'm sorry. What term were you talking about? Kenrya: Where she said that she started being an advocate for enthusiastic consent, not just in terms of sexual acts, but in terms of the structure of the union. Erica: I got it. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. Kenrya: I think that's pretty powerful, especially because people change. Relationships change. Things are typically in flux. It sounds like that flux is part of what attracted you to joining in this way. So it would make sense to be checking in, in that way. Yeah. Michelle B.: Right. Actually, one of my partners, we joke about the DTR, the define-the-relationship conversation, I think, is something that needs to happen on a regular basis. It's not just a one-time thing, which is in the relationship escalator model. There's all these implied ... This is where we're going. When you step away from that model, it's important to regularly figure out, based on what's going on, who's met who, where we are in our relationship. Kenrya: Right. It feels like a best practice for all relationships. Erica: I was about to say this sounds like this is something that everyone should do. I find, as we look at different relationship styles, to me, the more nontraditional the relationship, the more y'all doing shit that actually works how it's supposed to work, because it's- Michelle B.: It's the norms. Erica: Yeah. When you're just fucking somebody and somebody's like, "This is leading somewhere," and then, three years in, they're like, "I consider you a companion." And so- Michelle B.: On that point, I had a lot of destructive, heteronormative, monogamous relationships in the past, and also, I'm a victim of sexual assault. I actually find the norms of ethical non-monogamy to be protective because, generally, it's easy to find people who are very open about talking about the things that should be discussed, talking about boundaries, talking about consent, talking about testing, everyone getting tested on a regular basis. Things that are awkward or taboo in relationships that I had in the past are now just out on the table. It actually is a way that I am able to be more open and be more myself, because I just feel safer in those scenarios. Erica: Can we go back really quickly? You mentioned that you want to use the term ethical non-monogamy versus polyamory. Can you explain the difference between the two? Michelle B.: Yeah. To me, polyamory is when someone has multiple committed relationships, and ethical non-monogamy is a situation where there are more than two people, but everyone is engaging in enthusiastic consent. It could be a married couple who decide to open their marriage. It could be someone who's doing friends with benefits and has other relationships. It could be kitchen table polyamory where everyone knows everyone, or even there's some couples who have four or five people who all live together. So it could be a lot of different things. But, to me, polyamory is more emotionally intensive because I'm entering into a committed relationship with this person, and I'm giving fully of myself in an emotionally intimate way that I maybe wouldn't in some other types of relationships. Kenrya: Word. Erica: Thank you. Kenrya: In the book that we read, the relationship at the center story is absolutely polyamorous. They are in, all four of them, together, and they all love one another emotionally and sexually and all of the ways. There's a woman who is really the glue between her and then three men. But, as we just talked about, ethical non-monogamy can look a lot of different ways. I'm wondering, what does it look like for you now? Michelle B.: It has evolved because of the pandemic. I have a nesting partner who I live with and have been with in various forms of ... You could call it from monogamish to polyamorous for about four years. And right now, I have two other partners who are in the immediate vicinity. We all live in the same area. And then I have a long-distance lover who I wouldn't consider to be a partner. Kenrya: How has the pandemic influenced the way ... Yeah. I see you shaking your- Michelle B.: It sucks. Way less D. Like way less D. The challenge is everybody's been home. Spouses, partners, kids. Where do you get privacy to form that bond? One of my partners, we met shortly before the pandemic, so like January, before the lockdown. Everything was so scary, we just went for walks with masks on, for months and months and months. We didn't sleep together for a year, and we ended up forming this really tight friendship. And then, when we finally did sleep together, it was like, okay, so we're going to have this testing protocol, and then we're going to be isolated, and then we got to find an Airbnb, and we got to make sure the cleaning protocols ... I mean, it was a whole- Erica: All of that- Michelle B.: It was a production. Kenrya: ... for some dick or puss. Michelle B.: For some D. The thing that's so crazy about it is I'm trying to figure ... So I have another partner who is newer. We haven't slept together. It's really challenging because you kind of want these things to evolve a bit organically, but by the time you have hung out with someone for a year that you're attracted to, you're like, "When are we going to get to what we're going to get to?" If we don't have a place that we can easily be private with each other, then it means we have to be very intentional and say, "I think I would like to have sex with you. Can we plan it down to the minute details?" That's a little bit awkward. Kenrya: Or fun. Michelle B.: Yeah. Erica: To me, it seems like a lot of pressure on the situation, you know? Michelle B.: Exactly. Because I don't actually know how things are going to go, and I don't want to assume that- Erica: That we're going to fuck the- Michelle B.: ... we have to have intercourse or whatever. Yeah. I mean, we're attracted to each other, but we both need that time. Everyone needs to feel safe and comfortable. And when you have spent money on an Airbnb and arranged with the calendar god, make sure- Erica: Somebody's putting out. Michelle B.: ... someone's watching the kids, it does. It does put a lot of pressure on it. So that makes it a little bit harder, and there's just less sex as a result. Erica: In the book, the main character, she doesn't tell others about her relationship just for fear of judgment. We are doing this interview anonymous, so we don't have all your business out on the streets. Why do you think people stigmatize these relationships? Michelle B.: Yeah. I'm not sure that stigma is the right word, in terms of how I think about it. I think it's fear, and I think it's an issue of identity. In our society, monogamy confers benefits. It's something we don't talk about, but you think about the term friend with benefits. It's like as separate from monogamy because we know that ... implied there's all these benefits that come with monogamous relationships. And we have all kinds of ways. Capitalism and our political system favors a certain kind of family structure, and we have couple privilege. I think that people are either afraid of losing those benefits or them being compromised in some way, sort of like how white people are worried about losing the benefits of white supremacy. Even if they think it's wrong, they're not eager to sign up to release those benefits. Michelle B.: I think it's also an identity issue because, at the end of the day, we socialize women to see their worth in relation to others, in relationships and families. I mean, look at the ways that we celebrate women for getting married and having children. Compare that to any other kind of accomplishment. It can't even be compared. When you have something that's so powerful as a part of someone's identity, to try and strip that away can be really terrifying, I think, for some people. So I think that's probably where the stigma comes in, is in that fear response, that either I have something that I don't want to lose, or I have an identity that I don't want that identity to be threatened by the way that other people are living their lives. Kenrya: That's always interesting to me. I mean, I often describe white supremacy as like ... Well, I mean, it's got a lot of pieces to it, but part of it is that white people don't like to mind their own fucking business. Erica: I was just about to say there is an element of minding your own goddamn business that just ... Mind your own fucking business. Kenrya: How does it threaten this- Michelle B.: Yeah. Because white supremacy is so great for them, they're vigilant. They're all on the lookout to make sure that it stays in place. Any situation where it might be undermined in some way, they feel like they need to step in and do something about it. Erica: White supremacy is vigilant. That is ... Yeah. It makes all the sense in the ... I keep doing this, and I got broken nails. White supremacy is super vigilant. Sorry, y'all. Kenrya: It's fine. We talked a little bit earlier about the things that at least we see as people on the outside looking in, that it takes to make these types of relationships work, right? Tremendous amount of communication. Boundary setting. Not being a fucking child. Being mature. But I'm wondering, from the inside looking out, what does it really take to be happy in this kind of relationship? I think that people have ideas about what that looks like, but I'm wondering what it really looks like. Michelle B.: Honestly, I think being happy in a non-monogamous relationship is more about, one, your internal state than it is about the dynamic between you and the other person, because it requires you to think broader than you might be used to. One way that I think about this is I used to be broke, going through a divorce, single mom, struggling. When I needed clothes, I would go somewhere cheap, Target, TJ Maxx, and I would go straight to the clearance rack because that's just the way I shop. And so my clothes didn't really fit- Erica: Target is my chi. But okay. Kenrya: I'm about to say I still shop at Target. Michelle B.: The Target clearance rack at 70%? Come on now. Kenrya: Okay. Yeah. I have at least a couple of things in my closet that came from that clearance rack. Michelle B.: I have some cute clothes. I got this from Target. Erica: See? Michelle B.: Okay. And I have a matching blazer that I throw on over it. Erica: Yes. See? Michelle B.: Anyway. Look. Don't come for Target. Erica: No. But yeah. Kenrya: We would never. Erica: 70% clearance rack is like ... The arms are like this. Kenrya: So I know a lot of times that stuff is just out of season, and if you plan, then you can come up on some real deals. Anyway, go ahead. Michelle B.: Okay. For a long time, that was just what was possible for me. It was an important mental shift for me to give myself permission to buy full-price clothes and to not buy something that I didn't love. I think I had a lot of those same kind of ideas about relationships. It's like, okay, the relationship escalator says that eventually I want to have this, this, and this. So maybe, even though this guy ... I mean, he's okay looking. He's all right. He might be a good provider or whatever. There's already all these calculations where I have to fit myself into this box because I see it as a constraint. Michelle B.: Now I'm like, "You know what? I'm only going to buy stuff that I love. If I put it on and it doesn't fit, so what? I don't have to buy that just because I was in this little box." Now I'm like, "You know what? If I kiss this guy and my panties don't get wet, this is not it. I am only going to sleep with men who make me feel absolutely head over heels horny, like I can't wait to get into his pants. I only want to surround myself with men who make me feel like that, who make me feel seen and beautiful." Michelle B.: When you don't have to make all these calculations about the benefits of monogamy and, well, if I deal with this, I can settle for that, it's really me giving myself freedom to be in many different kinds of relationships and to allow myself to enjoy many different kinds of people, rather than placing all of that on one partner. But, more importantly, just being free myself has been the most important part. Michelle B.: So that's what I would say. Ultimately, it's not really going to matter if you have a partner who's a good communicator or whatever, but you have this own mental prison that you're in about how it has to go and what it has to be and what you can do and what you can't do and everything. And you don't have the freedom to go outside of that and say, "You know what? How about I just go for what I actually want? How about I just recognize that I deserve to have these relationships?" Michelle B.: I can just go with what is good and safe and pleasurable for me. I can just define my own boundaries and pursue that. And I know that there are people out there who will meet those requirements, because that's another big thing. I think we have a scarcity model about relationships. And especially me, as a single mom, I had this mentality that I was like damaged goods, and I don't. I mean, I recognize my own value, but also, I have been out there enough to know that there are men, there are women, there are people, there are billions of people in the world. I know that I can find people to enjoy and who can enjoy my companionship and so forth, that we can really enrich each other's lives. Kenrya: I love that for you. Erica: Yeah. I am just- Michelle B.: Me, too. Erica: ... in love with all that you just said. I feel like that's a powerful manifesto that needs to be shared and shouted from the mountaintops. It's beautiful that you are able to articulate that, and you came to realize that in the space of ethical non-monogamous relationships, but, girl, you need to be teaching to this to our monogamist sisters, because, yeah, I think the scarcity model ... I mean, I even think back about when I was in relationships before my marriage. It was just like, okay, this is good. This is okay. I mean, I've been saying I'm searching for perfection. This hand is really bothering me. Granted, there's no such thing as perfection, but I'm looking for what is perfect for me. I'm not going to settle for that shit because I remember how it feels in a relationship, in a marriage that is falling apart, and it's like fuck that. Michelle B.: Yes. Right. Not worth it. Erica: No more Marshalls 70% off. Kenrya: That's how I developed my strong block hand. Michelle B.: But let me tell you, when I go to Target, I still hit that clearance rack. Erica: Because you might find something good. Michelle B.: Look, I will enjoy the thrill of a cute dress for $17.43. Okay? But that's not the only place that I can go. When I want what I want, I go and I get what I want. But I can hit that clearance rack, too. So there's no judgment. No judgment. Erica: I love it. How does being Black color the way you show up as an ethical non-monogamous person? Michelle B.: Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, I encounter far fewer Black people who are interested in ethical non-monogamy than white people. That's just my sample. It means that most of my partners are white, and I'm good with that. My nesting partner is Black, and I think that I will always want that because it's like I have someone that speaks my native language of Ebonics at home. There's literally nothing that I can't say to him. There's a level of safety and communication that we have in a shared struggle of being Black that is absent from my other relationships. So I like that. But, yeah, I don't say the N-word around my white partners. Erica: I think it's dope that- Michelle B.: It is what it is. Erica: ... because you're not expecting your partner to be your everything, you're okay with it. Like you said, I'm good with it because I don't need that. Kenrya: I can say nigga at home. Erica: Yeah, exactly. Michelle B.: Yes. And I do. That's probably the only boundary, because it's like, okay, you can't say it, so I'm not going to say it around you because I don't want to put you in a position where you're like, "Well, how come I can't?" I just don't even want to go there. Everything else, though, I don't code switch around my partners. It's funny that my long-distance lover is Polish. Actually, two of them are immigrants. I decided I was going to pick up some Polish language on Duolingo, and studied it for a year and got to the point where I could read children's books. It was awesome and a learning experience. Michelle B.: And I taught him a little bit about African American Vernacular English just so that he could better understand some of the things that I would say. He always came at it with just sort of wanting to learn, not wanting to co-opt. And I would call him out if I felt like there were some appropriation. He plays guitar. Once he sends me this guitar lick, and I'm like, "Dude, this is Tony! Toni! Toné!, the beginning." He's like, "Oh, no, this is ..." I'm like, "No, I'm about to play this song for you." He's like, "I stole it from this white dude." This white dude stole it from- Kenrya: From Tony! Toni! Toné!. Erica: Tony! Toni! Toné!. Michelle B.: ... Tony! Toni! Toné!. Okay? Because that guitar lick that you just played, let me tell you, you need to give attribution where it's needed. So I have no problem calling it out. But going back to freedom in relationships, I just am who I am, and I happen to be Black. I'm in a phase of my life where I'm not an activist except in the ways that I show up in settings where I'm underrepresented, and I'm okay with that. I don't bring race as an agenda to my relationships. Certainly, there are people that I have weeded out because they're not where they need to be in order to be with me. But yeah, I mean, I just am who I am. I just only use the N-word with my partner at home. Kenrya: Okay. You're a mom, and we talked a little bit about how that contributed to it being a bit more difficult to be in your relationships during the pandemic. I'm wondering how being a parent impacts the way that you relate in general. Michelle B.: The way that I relate to- Kenrya: Your partners. Michelle B.: ... my partners? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). For me, it means that I don't always get to have sex when I want to have it, because I got this little person roaming around my fucking house. Michelle B.: Right. That is a huge challenge. It really came to the forefront in the pandemic. I love to be in relationships with people that I can learn a lot from. My nesting partner has no children and wants no children. But two of my other partners are married. One has a child that is a little younger than mine, and one has two kids that are in college. I'm like, "Wow." So it's really interesting to see how white people parent is very different from how I parent. It's something that I became very aware of in my relationships with white men in particular, white fathers. Michelle B.: I think it's interesting for me to see what the empty nest situation is. Sometimes I would talk to my partner about when your kids were getting on your nerves, now that you're looking back and they're in college, how would you put in perspective those very difficult teen years, for example? That's something we can talk about. So it's cool. It's just another layer of exposure for me to kind of get out of my own bubble. I think now that things are opening up again and kids are going back to school, I'm looking forward to having a lot more sex. But other than that, I think it's really just sort of observing how other people do what they do with their kids. Erica: What do you think people get wrong about ethical non-monogamy? Michelle B.: People who are in those relationships or on the outside? Erica: Outside looking in. Michelle B.: I think that they get wrong the emotional capacity of someone to love multiple people. I think another thing that they get wrong is imagining that people are exchangeable or interchangeable. I mean, I think about I am blessed to have my mother and father in my life. I love them both, and me loving one doesn't mean I can't love the other. I think about how we can have people who are in a similar role. You have someone who is parenting, but you can have a totally different relationship with one parent than you do with the other parent. And that's okay. That can be totally fine and normal. Michelle B.: I think that's one challenge, the thought that if I'm doing relationships right, then there's something problematic about me loving this other person in that kind of way. I just don't think that is necessarily true. It may be for some people, but I don't think it is something that should constrain all relationships. So emotional capacity is one and then interchangeable people. People are not interchangeable. Michelle B.: I think that people on the outside imagine like oh, well, great. If you have two partners and one you break up with one, you just get another one then. No. When I'm in a relationship and a relationship ends, I experience all the same span of emotions. I go through the same grieving process. And my relationships have evolved. One partner who broke up with me, I went home and cried myself to sleep. This was after I had already met my nesting partner. So we were together, and the fact that I had this other relationship didn't matter because what I had with him was our thing. It was unique. It was special. It was our dynamic that is very different from what I have with anyone else. So it's still something that was important to me, and it hurt when it didn't go well. I think, also, people think it's mostly about sex, which it might be for some people. But it doesn't have to just be about sex. Kenrya: Right. Related to that question, I'm wondering how do you feel about the way that ethical non-monogamy is portrayed in the media? Michelle B.: Huh. I don't see a lot of examples of it in the media. Maybe that's just me being workaholic and not watching enough TV. Oh, gosh. I saw the question list, and I thought about I watched a movie about it, and now I can't remember the name of the movie. And I thought, oh, yeah, I could talk about that movie. Kenrya: I'm wondering what movie that was. Michelle B.: This is about a movie about a guy who ... He and his girlfriend decided to open up their relationship. She went off and met this super great guy while he was struggling. And then there was a big reveal at the end of the movie. And then I went and when I watch movies and I'm really impacted by them, I go and read a thousand think pieces. Kenrya: Me, too. Michelle B.: It's my way of processing what I just saw. I remember reading all of these think pieces about how problematic it was, where there were just boundary violations, not enough communication, the challenges of symmetry. I think it raised a lot of questions. But, anyways, I'm sorry that's not as coherent as I would like it to be. But I think I will say that some portrayals that I have seen present it as very heteronormative, monogamous centered. It's like we have a regular couple who now they're deciding to branch out from monogamy to kind of supplement. They're keeping their relationship escalator intact while also exploring what they can do outside of that, which is fine for some people. But I think that is pretty narrow. I hope that as TV writing and film writing and so forth become more diverse, that more representations of relationships will be represented, and that we don't always have to start from the typical relationship structure. Erica: Sorry. Phone wanted to be a [inaudible 00:40:09]. What are you reading right now? Michelle B.: I am reading a lot about education. You mentioned that I'm a social scientist, and so I'm reading “Unequal City” by Carla Shedd. It is about young people in Chicago and how they are navigating their education and trying to avoid being sucked into the school-to-prison pipeline. Kenrya: Word. What's turning you on today? Michelle B.: Whew. What is turning me on? Hmm. I think the vaccines are turning me on because I'm about to have a hot girl summer. I'm so excited to travel and go and meet people. I'm going to see my long-distance partner in less than two weeks. I'm going to get just all kinds of D this summer. It's going to be great. And all the dating sites now have little signifiers if you're vaccinated. It is the sexiest thing right now. So I'm just like they got Juvenile and Mannie Fresh talking about “Vax That Thang Up.” Kenrya: “Vax That Thang Up.” I fell out. Michelle B.: I'm like, "Yeah. Yep." Erica: Okay. We're going to do a quick lightning round. I will say a word, and you will tell me the first thing that comes to mind, okay? Michelle B.: All right. Erica: Vacation. Michelle B.: Sex. Kenrya: Now I'm reminiscing. Erica: Drink. Kenrya: Sorry. I ain't had vacation sex in a long time. Michelle B.: Mimosas. Erica: Okay. Smell. Michelle B.: Mint. That's the first thing that popped in my mind. Erica: Good. That's what we want. Joy. Michelle B.: Books. Erica: Movie. Michelle B.: Black Widow. I just watched it. Erica: I did, too, and it wasn't bad. Michelle B.: It wasn't bad. Kenrya: Well, Michelle, thank you so much for coming on the show. We really enjoyed having you on. Michelle B.: Thank you for having me. Kenrya: That's it for this week's episode of The Turn On. Thanks for listening. We'll be back next week. [theme music] Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Hit subscribe right now in your favorite podcast app and at YouTube.com/TheTurnOnPodcast, so you'll never miss an episode. Erica: Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod, and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. You can find links to books, transcripts, guest information, what's turning us on, and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Kenrya: And don't forget to email us at [email protected] with your book recommendations and your pressing sex and related questions. Erica: You can support the show by leaving us a five-star review, buying some merch, or becoming a patron of the show. Just head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to make that happen. Kenrya: Thanks for listening. We'll see you soon. Holla.
LISTEN TO THE TURN ON
Amazon Music | Apple Podcasts | Google Play | iHeart Radio | Pandora | Radio Public | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn| YouTube CONNECT WITH THE TURN ON Instagram | Twitter | Facebook | Goodreads | Patreon SHOW NOTES In this episode of The Turn On, Erica and Kenrya read "Be Mine" by Savannah J. Frierson and talk about ethical non-monogamy, managing multiple partners, turning off the "cool girl" BS, the joys of being taken care of and the importance of highlighting the sweet before. Oh, and E apologizes to all the people she's half-ass kissed before. RESOURCES
ADVERTISEMENT Buzzsprout The Turn On participates in affiliate programs, which provide a small commission when you purchase products via links on this site. This costs you nothing, but helps support the show. Click here for more information. TRANSCRIPT Kenrya: So before we get started, we're here to do some begging. Erica: We are here to beg like 1980s and 1990 R&B stars like who? Keith Sweat. Kenrya: Keith Sweat, yeah. Remember when we saw him in concert? Erica: It was like the apex of niggas in linen pants, those little A tank tops, and Stacy Adams. Kenrya: It's true, but it was a damn good show. We were in our 20s when we went to that show. Erica: Yeah. Kenrya: We were very young. Erica: Now I wouldn't be mad at a fine gentleman in some nice linen pants. Kenrya: Me too. And I can still appreciate the begging of Keith Sweat. Erica: Can we? Like he says, he begs to your woman so you don't have to. Kenrya: Exactly, but today we actually do have to beg. Erica: We doing our own begging, right? Kenrya: Yeah. And you don't have to break out your linen, but what we do want is for y’all to tell us what you think about the show. Erica: Yeah, so it sounds like work, I promise it does, but it's painless. All you're going to do is head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com/Survey and answer a few questions. It will help us give you more of what you love. Kenrya: Yes, help us, help you. Erica: Yeah. On the survey, is one of the questions, “Do you guys enjoy Erica singing?” Kenrya: That is not one of the questions on the survey. Erica: I feel like it should be. Kenrya: You think it should be? Erica: I feel like it should be, but whatever. Kenrya: Just yo, if you all give us a few minutes of your time, you can help us give you more of the show that you love. And all you got to do is head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com/Survey. Yes, please, and thank you. Erica: Okay, so let's start the show. Kenrya: All right. Kenrya: Come here. Get off. [theme music] Erica: Hey, y'all. Welcome to this week's episode of The Turn On. Today we are reading “Be Mine: An Interracial Poly Romance Novella” written by Savannah J. Frierson in 2020. Sit back, relax, get your wine, get your weed, and get your whatever you need. Enjoy. Kenrya: “Be Mine,” by Savannah J. Frierson. Kenrya: "Why haven't y'all kissed me yet?" Three pairs of eyes looked at her with surprise. After nearly a week of this new normal, that was the only thing that had, well, remained the old normal. Their stares had been too long, too intense for them to be satisfied with the brief, innocent kisses they'd been giving her. Why have they been keeping themselves in check? Ye-Jun shrugged. "Why haven't you kissed us?" Ingrid blinked. "What?" "Kisses go both ways, Ingrid," Ade said, shrugging also. "You can kiss us. We wouldn't mind." Ingrid started to say something, then she clamped her mouth shut and looked at B.B. "What say you?" B.B. ducked his head and cut into his food. "I mean, they have a point." "You want me to kiss you?" Ingrid asked for clarification. "For a start," Ye-Jun said. "Or at least let us kiss you," Ade added. Kenrya: A flush that had nothing to do with pleasure overcame her. "What are you talking about?" Ade and Ye-Jun looked at each other, then at B.B., whose gaze remained riveted on his plate. The blond man cleared his throat, his large shoulders rising and falling with his deep sigh. "You tend to move your head when we kiss you." "Move it how?" Ingrid asked, her tone sharp and flint. "Away," Ye-Jun replied. "You run away from us." Her jaw dropped. "I do not!" "You do," B.B. insisted, now looking at her. "Anytime we come near your mouth, you hold your head away or you turn so we just glance it. I don't know about the others, but I had been trying to kiss you for days before settling on the other parts of you that you don't mind our mouths on." Kenrya: Ingrid released a hyper laugh. Of course she'd been self-sabotaging herself. When presented with three of the finest men she'd ever seen, leave it to her to hold them at arm's length. "I ... " She shut her mouth. She'd been about to say something self-deprecating and unkind about herself. Pursing her lips, Ingrid shook her head and started again. "I apologize for making y'all feel you weren't wanted." She couldn't look at them as she spoke, the tickle in her throat having morphed into a pebble and then a boulder. The plate in her vision began to blur and she stood quickly. The chair groaned across the hardwood floor. "Ingrid." "I got to go to the bathroom. Excuse me," she said, unsure if her words were audible for the tears that were threatening. She rushed into the downstairs powder room, locking it for good measure. Kenrya: This was the second time she'd fled into a bathroom because of them. She'd been so sure she'd tossed her doubts aside, but apparently they boomeranged right back without her really noticing. The porcelain of the sink was cool on her palms as she braced herself on it. She let a few of her tears slip out before taking several slow, deep breaths and shoving the rest back inside. Kenrya: She was resisting the very thing she asked for and was on autopilot as she did it. Did she think a shoe was going to drop? That they’d see her, realize how woefully inexperienced she was and change their minds? When she opened the door over a week ago telling Ade she wanted him to be her Valentine, all three had walked right in with confidence strides. She was the one still hovering at the frame, poking a head in without fully committing, fully trusting that this was something she could have, deserved to have. Kenrya: The clanking of dishes being cleared from the table filtered through the door and she sighed again. She needed to put one foot in front of the other like a big girl and stop tripping. What she wanted was right there for her to grasp, and all she had to do was reach out and claim it. Standing, Ingrid squared her shoulders and looked at her reflection in the mirror. No, she wasn't the greatest beauty and maybe she carried more weight than health charts said she should, but not one man in this house had ever made her feel less than beautiful, desired and wanted. Kenrya: That self-talk track she recorded and replayed in her subconscious has served its purpose when men she didn't want or didn't want her had entered her life, but they weren't here anymore. In this present, everything was mutual. She could do no less than honor that. Singing "I'm Coming Out" in her head, Ingrid left the powder room. Kenrya: All three men stood at attention when she came into view. "Hey," Ye-Jun said, caution clear in his voice. He stepped forward, but just the one step, his hand reaching out to her. She went to him, sliding his arm around her waist. "May I kiss you?" He swallowed, his Adam's apple bobbing. His hand squeezed her waist. "Yeah." He cleared his throat, his voice having come out higher and hoarser than he'd intended. "Yeah, I'd like that." She smiled, his response bolstering her confidence. She stood on the balls of her feet, bringing her body flush against his. He was firm and so warm, just like he'd been when he cuddled her during her cycle. Biting her bottom lip, Ingrid slid her fingers up his neck, feeling his pulse increase until she cradled his jaw. Ye-Jun closed his eyes, his lips parting at the sensation of her touch. Ingrid guided his head down so his mouth brushed hers. She pursed her lips to increase the pressure and he returned it. Ye-Jun didn't take over, letting her direct the intensity and tempo of this first kiss. She kept it light, the feel of his soft lips on her so exquisitely sweet. Kenrya: She broke the kiss and looked at him through her eyelashes. "Was that okay?" He smiled softly and bent his head, giving her his answer in the form of another kiss. This one wasn't gentle or hesitant. Ye-Jun knew exactly what to do with his lips, how much pleasure to apply, how raw her mouth should feel by the end of it, how wet she should be. Oh, how very wet. He only gave her a touch of tongue before drawing back. Ingrid clung to him, because her knees had lost all their strength. His smile transformed from sweet to smug. "Was that okay?" he parroted, knowing damn well it went beyond the adjective. Ingrid hid her face in his shoulder, feeling him chuckle at her expense and then squeeze her with a strong hug. "That was amazing," he ultimately said. "I should swat you for keeping that from me all this time." She smiled into his shoulder. "You just want to watch my ass jiggle." "Baby, watching you walk away is the most bittersweet experience of my life," he said, and she laughed outright, stepping away from him. She clasped her hands in front of her demurely, because she wasn't sure what else to do. "Thank you for letting me kiss you," she said. "Anytime," Ye-Jun said, "And I'm serious about that." Kenrya: Feeling her cheeks flame, she looked over at Ade and B.B. They both gazed at her with hunger in their eyes that made her breathless. Nevertheless, she recognized her desire was larger than her nerves and she arched an eyebrow at them. "Would either of you like kisses?" Ade brushed right by B.B. before the man could say anything, took her face in his wide hands and brought their mouths together. He was taller than Ye-Jun by a couple inches, so she had to strain her neck longer to reach but Ingrid didn't mind. His thumbs were gentle as they stroked her cheeks in the same slow tempo of his kiss. He wasn't aggressive. No tongues entered the fray, but he coaxed her mouth to move against his with gentle nibbles and tugs. He wanted her as a participant, not a mere recipient, and she let go of her worries of awkwardness and followed his expert lead. When the kiss finally ended, Ingrid felt dazed. His woodsy scent overpowering. She also felt a zing of triumph that Ade's hands trembled and his breathing was unsteady. "We're going to have to do this again," Ade said, his voice raspy. Ingrid smiled shyly. "I knew you'd be a good kisser, with those lips. Woof." Ade laughed and tugged her own bottom lip with his teeth. "Same here. Can't believe we haven't done this until just now. We wasted so much time." "We really did," Ingrid said, then looked around Ade to B.B. Kenrya: "Your turn, I suppose, if you want one." "I do," B.B. said, but he surprised her by walking by and going to the living room. After sharing a confused look with Ade and Ye-Jun, she also entered the living room where B.B. was sitting on the couch and patting his thighs. "I'm too tall, and the kind of kiss I want to give you wouldn't work." "Ah, shit!" Ye-Jun exclaimed, clapping and sitting down on the armchair. "Going to lay one on our girl." B.B. blushed and gave Ye-Jun a patient look. "Logistically, sitting is better." "You going to wait to sit every time you want to kiss her?" Ade teased. B.B. frowned, his growing self-consciousness evident, and Ingrid glared at the other two before sitting on his lap. She cupped her cheek in her hand and made him look at her. "Ignore them," she said, loud enough for him and the others to hear. "They're just mad you were able to give me an orgasm by kissing my elbow." The ribbing abruptly stopped and B.B.'s shyness transformed into a smug smile. "I like giving you an orgasm," B.B. said, sliding a hand along her hip and waist, "Even though I didn't mean to. I just like kissing you." "I like receiving it," Ingrid said, feeling more comfortable to admit that. "I liked you kissing me too. I'd like for us to do it again, on the mouth this time." Kenrya: B.B.'s smile was so sweet that she couldn't help but hug him. He held her close, her body trembling as he nuzzled her neck and jaw. She turned her head and kissed the evening growth of his cheek. Then they both moved so their lips could meet. He was the least assertive of the three, giving her the confidence to take what she learned from Ye-Jun and Ade and use it on him. He squeezed her side as her mouth traveled around his, as her teeth nibbled his lips. However, B.B. didn't remain passive for long, and by the time they ended the kiss, Ingrid realized she was reclining against the couch's arm with B.B. hovering above her, breathing like he'd just run a marathon. The thrill thrumming inside her made her giggle and she caressed his cheek. "You're an eager one." He shook his head and started to pull away, but her hands heightened around his jaw. "I'm sorry." "No," she countered, liking how red and swollen his lips were, how blown his pupils were, all because of her. "It feels good to know you desire me." He turned his face to kiss her palm, but his eyes remained locked on hers. "For a long time now," B.B. said. "Now that I can touch you, I'm greedy." Kenrya: A pair of hands settled on her shoulders and she looked above her to see Ade's face. "We all are." She looked around but she didn't see Ye-Jun. "Where's ... " "Jumping the gun most likely," Ade said with an exasperated sigh. Ingrid frowned. "What do you mean?" She heard thumping indicating someone coming down the stairs. Ye-Jun stopped in front of the television, breathing more heavily than normal. "Bedroom's ready." Ingrid's eyes widened and Ye-Jun's face colored at her obviously shocked expression. "I mean, if you are." Erica: Welcome back. Thank you, Kenrya, for that lovely reading. Look. Baby. Kenrya: This book, yo. Erica: This book is filthy in a good way. Kenrya: It is. It's quite possibly one of the dirtiest books we've ever ... Erica: This is not a shade. Kenrya: No. Erica: When we were starting to talk about, when we were planning for this episode and stuff, I was mapping out what was going on, and I called Kenrya and I was like, "Girl, all this fucking in this book and you pick to read a scene that wasn't fucking?" Why is that? Kenrya: That was on purpose. A couple of things. One, the sex scenes are very long because they are very filthy and there's four people who got to get off, and so it takes a long time. Erica: They do, because honey, I was doing a little work last night and was like, "I'm going to go to bed now." Kenrya: Then I think yes, this is a show about sex, and yes, we going to talk about the sex, but I was thinking about the fact that when people think about polyamorous relationships, particularly ones like this where everybody's loving on everybody, that they just go straight to the sex. One of the things that I like about this book is that Savannah spends a lot of time in the characters' heads, particularly in Ingrid's head, where she's thinking about whether or not this is how she wants to proceed. A little bit battling with her heart and with her head and all of that kind of stuff. I like this scene because it's the moment that she's like, "You know what? Yeah. I'm in. This is what I'm going to do." I think it's sweet. I think it's just enough of a hint of the filth that is to come. It does have them connecting on a physical level without it being who's inside of whom. I like that it was a prelude to that. Also, sitting here reading really filthy stuff is not always that easy with an audience. Erica: This always takes me back to that one story that we actually ended up scrapping. Kenrya: From our original pilot? Erica: Yeah. It was like, "Ah! Mm! Ee! Oh! Ah ah ah! Do it, girl, do it! Oh, oh, oh!" Kenrya: I kept laughing. It was a lot. Erica: I was like, "You know what? Nah." Kenrya: "Let's not do this one." Erica: Actually, Tia Williams said, she was like, "Writing erotica's difficult, because in the wrong hands, done improperly, it's either cheesy or very icky." Kenrya: This is neither cheesy nor- Erica: This is neither. Kenrya: ... icky. I just thought it would be nice to give folks the sweet before, because we talk about it all the time, how sex is not just penetration, that there's things that come before, and that's what this was. Now we want you all to get this book and read this book and get into the filth. Erica: This is the intimate bits of it. Yeah, girl. Nasty. I loved every minute. I was reading it on vacation, and I literally had to get up and go tap one of our mutual friends on the shoulder and was like, "Yo, Kenrya is nasty. She is nasty." Kenrya: Yo, when I say I read this book in a couple hours, I started it thinking, it was a Sunday, thinking I was just going to dip in and see if it was a possibility, because it was in our research period, and I couldn't stop. Erica: It's good. I don't want anyone, particularly Savannah, I don't want you to perceive us saying this is nasty, this is filthy, any way derogatory. I mean that in the most highest regard of like, you did the damn thing. You struck good story, all of that, character development, with just some good ole raunch. Actually, we were talking about, this book isn't as much of that, but I remember we were talking about what's the one piece that we wish was written. You were like, "Jump in and bam, fucking from the beginning." Kenrya: Even though this does not do that. Erica: Not fucking from the beginning, but the fucking that happened- Kenrya: Once they start- Erica: ... was grade A. Kenrya: Highlight reel shit. Erica: Yeah. This is going down. All that to say we recommend this book to everyone. That brings us to talking about what the fuck is the book even about, because we jumped in talking about how good the sex was. Do you want to give a synopsis? Kenrya: I can try. You might have to remind me of the names. There's Ingrid, there's Ade, there's B.B., and there's Ye-Jun. Am I saying that right? You're probably looking at it. I'm not looking at it. Erica: Ye-Jun. Kenrya: They all live together as roommates. The three guys live together in the big house, and she lives in a guesthouse. She owns it or her family does or something like that. They're all friends. The guys are all best friends. Two of them work together. They hang out. They have regular hangout nights together, whatever. Then ahead of Valentine's Day, Ingrid asks Ade to be her valentine. It opens this can of worms where he's basically like, "Hell yeah, but not just me." Apparently all three of them have been talking about how they all have feelings for her and how they all want to be her boyfriend. Then a lot of the book and what makes it so fantastic is just her negotiating what that looks like, negotiating with herself and then negotiating with them and trying to figure out what their life could look like as a- Erica: As a crew. Kenrya: ... part of a crew. Erica: Quarple. I'm trying. You know I have couple. Kenrya: Yeah, figure out what it is. Erica: Quarple. Quarple. Kenrya: I'm sure there's a word for it. We'll talk about this next week. There's a lot of different ways to be ethically non-monogamous. In this situation it looks like polyamory where all four of them are involved together. She's the linchpin. Erica: She's the piece, because they don't really have sex with one another, right? Kenrya: No, but they're also- Erica: They're brothers. They're brother-boyfriends. I hate using the term sister-wives, because I feel like people use it so disparagingly nowadays, but you can tell that they're good friends. They're brothers. Kenrya: Yeah, but when I think of ... Again, obviously I'm not in this type of relationship, but it's not as if each of them ... She does have her individual relationships with all three of them, but also, because they're all best friends, they have an emotional relationship, even if they're not, although they're all- Erica: Sexual. Kenrya: ... having sex together, they're not penetrating each other or anything like that. They're all in a relationship together, but she's the piece that they all pivot around. Erica: Girl. I would love to be at the center of anybody's universe. The center of a universe like that. I'm lying. I don't want to have to be that nice to that many people. Not at the same time. I do think it's dope how she has very individual relationships with each one of them. Kenrya: Their different things that they do together. Erica: Exactly. One walks her to work every morning. One brings her lunch. Kenrya: It's this concept of she's not trying to get everything from one person. She gets different needs met from the different mine. B.B. is the one who she connects with emotionally. When she needs to talk through stuff, he's- Erica: That's the white guy, right? Kenrya: That's the white guy. Erica: He's like a big teddy bear. In my mind he's like a big teddy bear. That's the most ... Never mind. I was about to say something wrong. This all kicks off with Valentine's Day, where Ingrid's like, "Look, I just want to be held and loved and cherished and made to feel like I am a special bitch on Valentine's Day. That's all I need." She didn't say it, but she was like, "Look, that's all I need." It makes me think, because as I'm going through this dating process, as I'm figuring my life out, I have had situations where I was just like, "You know what? Right now I just need a hug and a night together where we feel like everything's normal. Even though everything else is going wrong, and not wrong, but it ain't going anywhere, but let's suspend those thoughts and ideas for just a night, because I need some intimacy." I do that less now, I will say. You know what? No. Let me not even say I do that less now. I actually do it more now, because I am more honest about what's going ... I got my nails done. Can you tell? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). I see. Erica: I think I do it more now because I'm more honest about where I am, the situation at hand, who I'm dealing with, all of that. It's actually pretty damn dope. Not saying that I do it a lot, but I definitely, in the past, before I became sober, relationship-sober, I would do that and not be ... I'd be like, "Oh, this is trash. It's not going anywhere, but we going to play house for a weekend, because that's what I want to do." Then by Saturday morning I'm like, "We going to make this work." Whereas now I'm like, "Look, this ain't going nowhere. We know it's not going anywhere, but we want to snuggle, so let's just snuggle." When it's all over with. I like that Ingrid started out by saying, "This is what I want. This is what I need." I do think that she was selling herself short in this situation, and that's why. Even when she initially asked Ade? Kenrya: Ade. Erica: Ade. Good Midwestern tongue, I be trying to make things more difficult than it is. When she asks Ade about it and he was just like, "Wait, what?" He was like, "Bitch, you selling yourself short." She took it as a rejection. Kenrya: Viewed it like it was a rejection. Erica: He was like, "Nah bitch, come on back." Kenrya: He's like, "No, we got a proposal for you." Erica: He had a whole kit and caboodle. Have you done that in relationships, either knowingly, or looking back, unknowingly? Kenrya: Sell myself short? Erica: No, not sell yourself short. Suspend all reality for the sake of getting what I need. Kenrya: Yes, if what I needed was to be fucking codependent. Erica: This reminds me, we were in the pool on Saturday and I was like ... Kenrya: Yeah, I've stayed places too long, for sure. I used to, in my 20s, almost brag about the fact that I was always the one to end things. They were always with good reason. Erica: I was like, "Bitch, you should've did that six months ago." Kenrya: Exactly. That's where I was going with that. Yeah, done that. Erica: Outside of codependence, have you been ... I look like the Hunchback of Notre Dame with this sweater on. Kenrya: No, you don't. Erica: Sorry, I had a sweater that's giving me extra back flub. Kenrya: Is that what it is? Erica: Outside of being codependent, have you just been at a point in your life where you're like, "I need to feel like I'm a relationship for a day. Come on over. Let's act like it. I know you got shit going on." Not shit as in other families or anything, but, "I know you got shit going on. We're still going to make it work." No? Kenrya: No, I don't think I've ever done that. Erica: Captain Dumb over here at your service. Kenrya: Nah. Erica: Valentine's Day, we've talked about this a bit, because I think me and you have in the past been like, "Oh, I don't do Valentine's Day." Kenrya: "Cool girl." Erica: Where I'm realizing the more ... I've actually added it to my list. I want to be loved out loud. I want to be loved, because I'm the type of person, I love out loud. If you my man, I'm like, "That is my nigga! Mm, he the best!" I want the same thing for me. Kenrya: You deserve. Erica: I totally deserve it. Kenrya: Shit, everybody does. Erica: (singing) That was me singing Tank and Mama D. Kenrya: Okay. Erica: What'd you say? Kenrya: I said okay. Erica: Now I'm more of the Valentine's Day is a thing camp. I want the flowers. I want the chocolates, even though I'm not going to eat them. I want a dinner. I want some fancy shit. You did Valentine's Day with your current partner, right? Kenrya: Yeah. We don't do fancy. I get my favorite flowers. We eat Chinese food, just because it's our tradition. He buys my favorite pie, which is expensive as hell and has to be preordered and going and picked up. Erica: I be showing up the next day like, "You have some of that Valentine's pie?" Kenrya: It's just nice. He writes me cards. He wrote me a card for our first Valentine's Day with a poem in it! This nigga. I was like, "What?" It's on my mirror perpetually. Erica: He wrote the poem? Kenrya: Yeah, he wrote that. Erica: Oh, wow. I haven't seen it. Kenrya: I thought I showed it to you. Whatever. He wrote it. It's funny, because he's funny. Part of why it's on the mirror is to make fun of him. Erica: (singing) I'm realizing that I like romance. I love the romance. I'm leaning into it, especially hosting this show now. I'm leaning into loving the romance and the tradition and customs that relationships have. I went on a date recently, and this guy brought flowers. It was very ... Kenrya: That's sweet. Erica: It was sweet. I don't get flowers. I do, but not like that. Only reason I get flowers often is because a bitch been in and out of the hospital and surgeries and things. Kenrya: I send you flowers sometimes. Erica: You do. Kenrya: That don't have to do with you being in the hospital. Erica: I know, but I ain't trying to fuck you, so [inaudible 00:32:28]. It was just so sweet to get flowers and be doted on. It was just so dope. Kenrya: It's a nice feeling. Erica: Yeah. Initially it was weird. I had to get past the, "Now what do I do?" I was like, "No, this is beautiful." Kenrya: You say, "Thank you." You say, "Thank you." Erica: Exactly, "Thank you," put them in water. Have you had a memorable Valentine's Day, either amazing or horrible or both? Kenrya: I've had both. Erica: Give me a high and give me a low. Kenrya: So memorable have just been all the ones with my current partner. Erica: All right. Kenrya: They follow exactly what I just ... Champagne. I can't drink anymore. Chinese food every time and we get our pie. One of the things I love about him is that he likes traditions as much as I do. We have created all these traditions for all of these things, like for his birthday, for my birthday, for my kid's birthday, for Valentine's Day, for Christmas. Erica: I love traditions. I guess it's the type A-ness in me where I want to know- Kenrya: What's going to happen. Erica: ... what's going to happen and how can we riff on this. Kenrya: It's comforting. It gives you something to look forward to. I don't know. We can build on them and do additional things or change them up. For his first birthday, not too long after we met, I baked him my cake, that cake that everybody like. Then for his birthday this last year I made what I had come to find out was his favorite cake, which I'd never even seen him eat before. I found a recipe. I made that shit from scratch scratch. Erica: What kind of cake? Kenrya: He likes Boston cream pie. It's good as fuck. Erica: With cream, you ate it? Kenrya: Yeah, I tasted it. Erica: Oh, wow. Kenrya: Yeah, I tasted it. Erica: It sounds like a bubble gut express. Kenrya: Yeah, but it was worth it. It was really fucking good. Then I sent him home with the whole thing. Erica: Like, "All right." Kenrya: I was like, "Take that out of my house." That's the way that that has evolved. I always bake for him on his birthday, because he likes my baking. I just do different things or whatever. A low, I pretty much realized I was getting a divorce on Valentine's Day. Erica: Do you want to share exactly what it is or is that? Kenrya: Nah. Erica: All right. That's perfectly- Kenrya: That's something I'm writing about. I don't think it's something I want to share here. Erica: I think that just to go back about traditions, I think because I have experienced so much loss with the people that I love in my life, traditions mean so much to me, because I have the one thing that I feel the ... I feel the closest with my mama when I'm cleaning up my house, listening to “The Preacher's Wife” soundtrack, because for some reason that's my Christmas soundtrack, decorating my house for Christmas Day, or making my granny's dressing for Thanksgiving. Traditions are the one piece of me that I have to hold onto the people that I love in my life. I feel like that is what they handed down. That's what they have from their grannies and their moms. They passed it on to me. It's just the whole ancestor piece of it all. I like them in relationships also because that's my love. I guess your familial love is the first type of love, and it transfers onto relationships. Erica: I love Valentine's Day. I try to do this with my son. When we were little, my mom would always ... We'd wake up Valentine's morning and there'd be a balloon, card, and candy for each of us, even when we were going through some of our ... I'm about to start crying. Even when we were going through some of our hardest times, we always had a Valentine's Day card, them little conversation hearts, and a balloon, and maybe a stuffed animal. I guess that's why it feels so good to me. For a long time I was like, "I ain't doing Valentine's Day. I don't have to do Valentine's Day." No. Now I want all the shit. I want flowers. Kenrya: Good. Erica: I want candy. I want all of that. I actually went on a first date on Valentine's Day. We didn't realize it was Valentine's Day though. Kenrya: That's funny. Erica: We couldn't get reservations. We was like, "What the fuck?" It was like, "Oh, shit." Kenrya: "Oh, it's that day." Erica: "It's Valentine's Day." Kenrya: It's interesting, I know for me the whole, "I'm too cool for Valentine's Day," really came out of not really wanting to be vulnerable. For me, I didn't want to make this big deal out of this thing with this person who was perhaps not making a big deal out of me. I didn't want to expose that by pushing. It was easier for me to say that I didn't care, to not make plans, even when I was in relationships, because better to just shut the fuck up and not have it be made entirely clear that this is not what I want it to be. Erica: Not be big. Not take up too much space. I'm now like, "Look, I like it. I want it all. I want it big. If you can't even fucking scrape up enough energy to entertain me on that bullshit, you ain't for me, because I'm going to scrape up energy to entertain you on a fucking NBA Draft," or whatever the fuck them people do with baseballs and things. If you can't give me that energy, then I don't want it. Kenrya: That's right. Erica: My Valentine's Day date, it was actually interesting, because we had just been talking and getting to know each other, and it was like, "I'm free this day. You free this day. You don't have your kid. I don't have my kid. We going to get together." Then as we were trying to make plans we were like, "Oh fuck, that's Valentine's Day." We ended up ordering food and hanging out. It was a good situation. This is literally our first date, so I'm not going to put that pressure on you. Also I had gotten flowers delivered from somebody else earlier that day. I'm not going to put that kind of pressure on you. I do also think that in a new relationship, Valentine's Day is always a little dicey if you're not talking, because you don't know how much to spend on a gift, especially if this is your first holiday together. Kenrya: I'm thinking. We don't really do gifts. It's funny, we were trying to think about it leading up to Valentine's Day this year. We were like, "Wait, do we do gifts?" Erica: Shit, you all Christmas and birthday gifts be fucking ... Kenrya: Yeah, and then we do random gifts. Then we were like, "Oh, we don't do Valentime's Day gifts," and so we're like, "Okay." Erica: Valentime's. Kenrya: Whatever, bitch. We didn't do them for the first one, and so we just whatever. Also Valentine's Day falls smack in between his birthday and mine. Erica: Happy Valentine's Day. Kenrya: It's a lot. Erica: (singing) Kenrya: Basically. Erica: Girl, I'm literally having a ... Do you see my face? I'm sweating. I'm having a hot flash as we speak. Kenrya: Where's your little fan thing? Erica: Girl, it's whatever. It's fine. We don't need the noise. It's all good. Kenrya: Take that thing off. Take off your sweater. Erica: You all don't want to see what's underneath this. You all don't need to see what's underneath this. I have on a tank top and right now my titties are like this. One's on floor three, the other one's on floor five. Don't worry, we getting it fixed soon, but yes, it's all good. Sorry. Something else in the story. Ingrid had her period. Was that the first couple thing that they did together? Kenrya: Yeah. I forgot about that. Erica: First, so happy I don't do that right now. I'm not menstruating. It was cute and sweet. Kenrya: It was. They were all so very concerned. Also, you all, she has dysmenorrhea, so incredibly painful periods. Go ahead. Erica: Someone knows what that's all about. Kenrya: Yeah, it's not great. Erica: Again, as I get more in touch with myself, I need that kind of energy. If I'm not feeling well, I need you to booboo me. I'm tired of being strong and resilient and all that shit. I want to lay in bed in a puddle, have you rub my belly, feed me soup, all that shit, because, I say this because I want to do the same thing for you. I might cuss you out when I walk out the room. I'm like, "This fuck. All it is a splinter in his finger." I think it's sweet. I thought that was really sweet, because one, periods can suck. As a part of the work I'm doing, I'm trying to work on how to reframe menstruating. I'm trying to reframe that. I don't want to be completely like, "It's the pits!" Kenrya: Because for some people it's not. Erica: For some people it is, and not because it physically is, but because they made it that. They've given it that energy in their head. Some people, it sucks. Kenrya: Also for some people it's because it's a body dysphoria issue as well for some people who menstruate. Erica: I was going to get to that, because I recognize that that shit is painful. Watching you go through it, watching my sister go through it, I know that it is fucking horrible. I think it was really nice that her boyfriends honored her going through this and babied her and gave her all the things that she needed. I was talking to this intuitive. We were talking about periods. She was saying that she had two daughters and they would all come on their cycle around the same time. She was like, "My husband just knew to leave us alone." Short of moving out of the house for that time. He did, because it became a point, it became a ritual. She said it became a ritual in her home where her and her daughters gave their bodies everything that it wanted, needed, and craved in that period, because it was honoring it for what it was going through. I thought that was a really good way of putting it, not like, "Oh, I'm bloated. I want chocolate." No. My body says it wants chocolate, because it wants chocolate. It's going through some things, and so let's give it chocolate, as opposed to being like ... Kenrya: Why did that mean that he had to fade into the background? I don't get that part. Erica: Because she was like, "This ain't about you. This about me and my daughters are going through what we're going through in our body and you can kick rocks." She was talking about more like centering herself and her womanhood and all of that and telling her husband, "Kick rocks. It ain't about you." As someone who no longer periods, but watches my close friend go through it, I thought that that little whole scene and situation was just so sweet. Also, can we give a shout-out to their living situation? Kenrya: That she has her own little house? Erica: She has her own little she-shed in the back, and then they have the house. She lives with them. Kenrya: Goes there when she wants to get away. Erica: She gets to go to her she-shed when she needs to. If I'm going to have three boyfriends, I'm going to need my own space. Kenrya: Honestly, that shit sounds exhausting. Erica: Having three boyfriends? Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: Fuck yeah. I don't want to be nice to three people. I don't want to be nice to one person all the time. You got to be nice to me all the time. Kenrya: For me it's not even necessarily about being ... I don't have a lot of time. In past relationships, men have tried to make me feel guilty about the fact that I work a lot and have other things going on that don't involve them. That's obviously not an issue now. My partner works just as much as I do. Erica: Yup. All set up at your daughter's desk to do so. Kenrya: Right next to me, exactly. It works for us because we both are on the same workaholic wavelength, which is not healthy, but whatever. We're also good at telling each other, "Hey, put that shit down and come here." Erica: Yeah, because you all good at checking each other. If only you took your own advice. I'm glad that he has you to give whatever. You get what I'm saying? Kenrya: Yeah. The idea of having to navigate that with three different people, I know me and I know that I would always feel like I was stretched a bit too thin and like I wasn't giving anybody enough of what they deserved, just because I've got so many things going on all the time. Then you add on my health and being tired all the fucking ... I fall asleep on this nigga every day. I don't know how I would ... I don't know. It would feel daunting for me. Erica: I never understood the whole, "I don't have time to date," or, "I don't have time to," until this period in my life. You really got to be doing some sparkly shit for me to be like, "Okay, I'm going to disconnect." We were just having this conversation moments ago. You make time for what you want. Kenrya: For sure. Erica: I'm not trying to want three people. Kenrya: I wouldn't want it to feel like something that felt like work, not like something I'm working at, because relationships require energy and intention, but I wouldn't want it to feel like, "Okay, let’s..." Erica: Make sure I'm giving this person the time that they need. On the other side of the coin, I guess you make the relationship what it is. Kenrya: What you all want it to be. Erica: Maybe with one partner it is we see each other quarterly because that's all we have for one another. That's what works. Kenrya: You're right. Erica: Again, to each his own. You like it, I love it. Kenrya: You build the relationships that work for you. Except for now every time I hear, "You like it, I love it," I just hear, "Says a Black woman who neither likes nor loves it." Erica: This time I do like- Kenrya: Because most of the time that's true. Erica: ... and love it. This time I do like and love. Girl! Kenrya: What? Erica: They were kissing. They were kissing a lot in that scene you read. Kenrya: You don't like kissing. I'm like, "Why are you freaking out?" Erica: In that scene you read, they were doing a lot of kissing. I literally have, "Kissing, ick." They were doing a lot of kissing. Kenrya: What you was finna to say? Something you shouldn't say? Erica: Fuck it. You know I don't like kissing, right? Kenrya: Yeah. Erica: My kisses aren't like ... They're like ... Which, whatever, until I kissed someone that kisses that way, and I was like, "Oh, bitch, this is horrible." I got to fix it. I got to fix it. I got to fix it, because it was not ... Kenrya: Passionate or ... Erica: It was just like, "What the fuck's going on here?" If you've ever kissed me in the past- Kenrya: Oh my God. Erica: ... and you got this, I apologize, because now I recognize that shit was fucked up. Kenrya: It's funny, my partner will not admit that he doesn't like kissing, but I know that he doesn't like it as much as I do. He totally kisses me just because I want a kiss, but it's definitely not on his list of favorite shit to do. Erica: The thing is I like kisses. I like snuggling. Again, I'm realizing that one of my love languages is ... You know what? Fuck it. I like all the love languages. I like physical touch. I love laying in the bed, holding hands, kissing, lots of kisses on your face. If you have a bald head, I will just kiss that little noggin to death. In the mouth, it's just really weird. Again- Kenrya: It's not your thing. Erica: I apologize, y'all. Also in the scene you read, Ingrid had to give herself a pep talk. Again, this book, Savannah did a really good job of writing what's going on in Ingrid's head, how she's processing this. That point where she was having the pep talk of like, "I could hit the gym more. I do have this." She was like, "Wait, bitch. Wait." Kenrya: "Don't do that." Erica: She was like, "Don't do that. I don't like that." She was like, "Ain't nobody got no problem with this, so why the fuck do I have a problem with this." Sometimes you need to have that outside reminder to remind yourself of, "You bad bitch. Keep it going." I had to burp and I was trying to mute. Kenrya: You did successfully mute it, but also your face looked like you burped. Details. Erica: That's a little fun. That is more incentive to watch this excursion. Kenrya: To watch us. Erica: More incentive for you to watch us on YouTube. Kenrya: To see Erica burp. Erica: Also the consent that was written in this scene was just so darn cute. It was like, "Would you like?" "Yes, I would like." "Oh, I like that. Would you like?" These young kids these days, it's just so adorable. Kenrya: How old are they supposed to be? I don't know. Erica: I don't know. I just talk about any ... I feel like an old lady sitting on a porch. This reminds me about I was watching “House Party.” There was this scene where they were talking about, "You got a jimmy hat? You got a prophylactic?" Kenrya: Prophylactic. Erica: Good Midwestern tongue. It just reminded me of how in the '90s and early 2000s there was lots of conversation around writing condoms into movie scenes or it was a part of the story. Kenrya: Yes very much. Erica: Granted he did say “backstage underage,” but he also said the “J, the I, the M, the M, the Y, yo.” Kenrya: Yeah, but. Lord have mercy. Oh God. Erica: I like how I feel like now we're seeing a lot more consent written into stories. To show how it's done without being weird or awkward. Kenrya: Hamfisted. Erica: I am a verbal bitch. I need you to tell me how good this pussy is while you in it. I also need you to tell me you cannot wait to kiss me. Do you want me to kiss you? Yes, I want you to kiss me. How hard do you want me to kiss you? So I feel it in my pussy. I don't know if that's right. Sorry. Kenrya: Lord. Erica: I am a hot mess. Last point. Self-sabotage. When they were talking about the kissing, I can't remember exactly who it was, but they were talking to Ingrid and it was like, "Would you like to kiss me?" No, "Why don't you kiss me?" It was like, "Why don't you kiss me? It goes both ways." Then they were like, "Every time we look like we about to kiss you, you run away." It made me think about the self-sabotage, how do we shoot ourselves in our foot running from things. Did you ever do that? Kenrya: Yeah. My current relationship that we've- Erica: Your origin story. Kenrya: ... talked about on this show, yeah, I basically ended it before it could start, because I made what we call “The Unilateral Decision.” Erica: Is that the term for it? Kenrya: Yes, capital letters. When we refer to it, that is how we refer to it, “The Unilateral Decision” that I made. Thank God it didn't stick. We were still hanging out, lying to ourselves, talking about we just friends who hung out every fucking day. Erica: RIP Biz Markie. Kenrya: Aw. Yeah. Erica: Now I know what I'm going to title this episode. We'll get to that later. Kenrya: They start out as friends. Erica: Could be “Happy Valentine's Day” or we could do- Kenrya: We could. Erica: ... (singing) I think we're going to do “Just A Friend” just as a RIP. Kenrya: I think that works. Erica: I'm sorry, you all totally in on a production call. Kenrya: Schedule. Erica: Right now but it's okay. Kenrya: It also shows you all when we recorded this. Just a couple days ago. Erica: I think that's all I've got. You got anything else? Kenrya: Just for our more gentle listeners out there, don't be afraid to read this just because we said it's filthy. Erica: Don't be afraid. It's a good book. Kenrya: It's a fantastic book. It's well written. It's part of a series. After I finished this one, I downloaded the second one and I read that the same day too. It's incredibly well written. The characters are super well developed. They all have their own distinct personalities and quirks and motivations. Everybody feels realistic. You care about these people. Erica: Getting in Ingrid's head was the best part to me. If you are not exposed to polyamorous relationships, then ... This would be considered polyamorous, right? Kenrya: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Erica: It's a legit relationship. If you're not used to that and haven't been exposed to it, I think it's a good read on just getting in someone's head on how they decide to do this. Also recognizing that we live in the fucking world we live in where motherfuckers are judgey than a motherfucker. Don't be hesitant to read it. Kenrya: The other thing I would say, when I saw the subtitle, which is something like interracial whatever, I don't really read those books. Erica: Yeah, we don't. Kenrya: Not on purpose. Erica: This book is just a- Kenrya: There's no fetishizing. They just happen to be home boys who look different. Erica: Even with Ingrid being a little thick girl, it's not a- Kenrya: A big deal. There's no after-school messaging. Erica: That's why I told him, "You're going to love this FUPA!" None of that. Kenrya: Exactly. There's none of that. At the same time, I'm trying to remember honestly if it was in this book or the second book, but they don't act like race doesn't exist. It's not as if race doesn't enter into- Erica: It's in this book. It's at the end of this one. Kenrya: They don't live in some world where race doesn't exist. They talk about it very matter of factly in the way that we all do. It's always weird. It's not fetishized, which I can't fucking do at all. It's also not like- Erica: "We don't see color." Kenrya: ... they live in some utopia. Exactly. It's not colorblind or no bullshit like that. This is just a part of who everyone is. Ingrid is a Black woman, obviously. Erica: All righty. That wraps up this part. We going to pay some bills and then come back to ... Kenrya: What's Turning Us On. Kenrya: Hey, you all. Today's a great day to start your own podcast, whether you're looking for a new marketing channel, have a message you want to share with the world, or just think it'd be fun to have your own show like us, podcasting is an easy, inexpensive, and fun way to expand your reach online. Buzzsprout is hands down the easiest and best way to launch, promote, and track your podcast. Your show gets put online and listed in all the major podcast directories like Apple Podcast, Spotify, Google, literally everything, within minutes of finishing and uploading your recording. We use it here for The Turn On, and I can truly attest to the fact that it's pretty fucking dope. Podcasting isn't hard when you have the right partners, and the team at Buzzsprout is passionate about helping you succeed. Join over 100,000 podcasters like us who are already using Buzzsprout to get their message out to the world. Just click the link in our show notes and you'll be able to get your own account set up. If you sign up for a paid plan, you'll get a $20 Amazon gift card and support our show. Let's create something great together. Sign up for Buzzsprout today. Kenrya: All right, good people. We are back. Erica: What's turning us on this week? Kenrya: I guess because of, I don't know, the stuff I watch or whatever, I get served a lot of ads for things on IG. Erica: You got served? What you get served? Kenrya: I did. I'd seen this a couple of times but didn't really whatever. Then my partner saw it and sent it to me. He DM'ed it to me on IG and was like, "For the show?" He's so helpful. Erica: That's the reason you had no idea what it looked like in the package? Kenrya: Yeah. I wasn't the one who opened it, and I never put it back, because whatever. Erica: Because you were laying there twitching. Continue. Kenrya: This is a toy that is advertised online. It's a clit stimulator but it's also- Erica: I'm sorry. Can we say that this whole season of What's Turning Us On shows that Kenrya's doing all the fucking. Continue. Kenrya: You did the first half of stuff, because I hadn't done any- Erica: [inaudible 01:04:33]. Kenrya: ... testing and ordering and things. It's everybody in the comments. There's thousands of comments for this. It's like- Erica: Show me! Kenrya: I'm about to show you. It's like, "I always wanted to squirt but didn't think I could. This thing, I used it to masturbate and I finished in two minutes. It's the ultimate. I don't even need a nigga no more because I got this thing," kind of a thing. We're reading the reviews. We're like, "We should try this out." This is it. It is quite large actually. Erica: This looks fun! Keep going. Tell me more. Kenrya: For those who can't see- Erica: I might have to stock some of them joints for myself. Kenrya: It's purple silicone. It's got two different parts to it. This part is meant to be inserted. You see it has these ridges, and these are for G-spot stimulation. The whole thing vibrates. It's got controls for two different things, which again, I don't know how to work. One of the buttons makes it vibrate, and the other button operates this part, which it's like a little circular part. Erica: (singing) Kenrya: It's made to sit right over your clit and to suck it like a person would. Erica: I would fucking lose my mind with that joint. Kenrya: We have used it as a foreplay kind of a thing. Erica: There wouldn't be no afterplay with that joint. Kenrya: We use it. He watches while I use it. He helps me position it. Then I finish in two minutes fucking flat. Then we keep going, because it's fast. Erica: Get that out the way. Kenrya: Then we keep moving. Then I tend to keep coming, so it's nice. The last time we used it though, I don't know if I didn't have the position right. Erica: Did you squirt? Kenrya: Huh? No. Not yet, but it's coming. It's so fast. Erica: You got to keep going. That's the thing. You feel like it's too sensitive, don't take it off. Kenrya: The last time we did it, that's what I was going to say, I don't know if I didn't have it positioned quite ... I didn't come fast enough. Maybe it was just turned up too high. Erica: Your clit was like, "No!" Kenrya: I was numb by the time I ... I was like, "Take this out." Then when we went to continue, it was hard for me to even finish, because it had numbed the clit. All that to say, listen to your body. Erica: With great power comes great responsibility. Kenrya: Great responsibility. Don't turn that shit up too high. Two out of three times I came damn near instantaneously. Shit is ridiculous, because it is doing all the things all at once. I don't know if you all can see the scale of quite how large it is, but it's a decent size for a toy that's inserted. Erica: She's holding her hand up like she's showing- Kenrya: Like I'm doing a makeup tutorial. Erica: Tutorial showing spices. Kenrya: It's covering damn near from my wrist to my middle finger. It's pretty large. Erica: Large and in charge. Kenrya: It's good. We'll put a link to the show notes. It's good for solo play. It's good for partner play. It's good for whatever kind of play you would like to do. Try it out. Erica: That wraps it up. Kenrya: It does. Erica: That wraps up this week's episode of The Turn On. These are your two favorite hoe hosts, Erica, Killa, two hoes, making it clap. Kenrya: Ayyye. Bye. [theme music] Kenrya: This episode was produced by us, Kenrya and Erica, and edited by B'Lystic. The theme music is from Brazy. Hit subscribe right now in your favorite podcast app and at YouTube.com/TheTurnOnPodcast, so you'll never miss an episode. Erica: Then follow us on Twitter @TheTurnOnPod and Instagram @TheTurnOnPodcast. You can find links to books, transcripts, guest info, what's turning us on, and other fun stuff at TheTurnOnPodcast.com. Kenrya: Don't forget to email us at [email protected] with your book recommendations and your pressing sex-and related questions. Erica: You can support the show by leaving us a five-star review, buying some merch, or becoming a patron of the show. Just head to TheTurnOnPodcast.com to make that happen. Kenrya: Thanks for listening. We'll see you soon. Holla. |
The Turn On
The Turn On is a podcast for Black people who want to get off. To open their minds. To learn. To be part of a community. To show that we love and fuck too, and it doesn't have to be political or scandalous or dirty. Unless we want it to be. Archives
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